Currency exchange while traveling: why do some still carry wads of cash? (page 19 of 28)

I don’t quite see the connection between a credit card’s spending limit and the minor and major tax evasion involving VAT, income tax, corporate tax, social security contributions, etc.?

Dear Attila, We’re getting into moral questions here... What’s the topic?

One topic can go off in all directions. And there’s a link between fraud and the original subject.

That link was even mentioned in the introduction.

Hello everyone, In an era of zero-commission cards and fee-free accounts, I wonder why some travelers still prefer to carry a wallet full of cash and exchange it on the spot? I get the appeal for those who earn undeclared income, but what about everyone else?

Shall we start over?

Hi there,

You know, like all of us, that Virtue (with a capital V) is out of reach for imperfect humans like we all are at one point or another... Even you! I don’t consider it illegal or immoral to pay my expenses abroad—or even in France—in US dollars or euros. This money belongs to me, and I didn’t steal it from anyone... It’s really France in the age of permanent suspicion—all of this! My neighbor has more than I do, drives a BMW while I only have a Citroën, he goes to Canada with his family while I spend my vacations in the Creuse at the family house, so obviously, it’s all suspicious!!! He must be cheating, he has hidden income... Some of you have probably seen Americans pulling out wads of bills from their pockets, sometimes $100 bills (in casinos, for example), and this massive use of cash doesn’t seem to bother the IRS. So why all this hysteria and cheap moralizing from our politicians across the board? Let’s also note that banks—which barely make money by skimming their customers’ savings accounts—are raking it in with those "painless" fees (until you get the bill once a year) generated by the relentless use of credit cards, even for paying the baker... It’s absurd! The shared guilt we all feel—enough already! Let us live and spend our money as we see fit. And let the State focus on real fraudsters (including those in white collars)... In this era of technological (cameras) and digital surveillance (state spyware), freedom and democracy are under threat. When an all-powerful State meddles in everything (I saw this in Norway, for example, the proclaimed paragon of the most advanced democracy), it’s hard not to think of George Orwell...

Moana

You really have no idea about the global scale of dirty money? 😮

It has nothing to do with my neighbor, my boss, or my cat.

You can honestly own a Ferrari and dishonestly own a Dacia. And vice versa.

Good evening,

Could you give me your definition of "dirty" money? Earned dishonestly? According to what, in whose eyes? How many states that lecture others on morality when preaching to those who finance and support them behave completely differently when acting on their own behalf? Honest or not—according to whom? The state? The tax authorities? Heaven?

You really have no idea about the global scale of dirty money? 😮 It has nothing to do with my neighbor, my boss, or my cat. You can own a Ferrari honestly and a Dacia dishonestly. And vice versa.

Michel

Attila! You're going off-topic... And you're breaking down open doors.

I still feel like a bit of a professional deformation makes you somewhat Torquemada-like.

Actually, I have a Dacia. but I’m being totally honest.....😏

Moana

It's me again...

What’s the point of playing the knight in shining armor if it just makes you sick, unsatisfied, and bitter? The world’s imperfect—you can’t fix it all by yourself! 🤪 Now, if you’re a tax agent, a finance inspector, a brilliant IT specialist recruited by the Ministry of Finance, or even a professional hacker working for the government, then go for it and catch those who push the limits. And if you want and can afford the Ferrari of your dreams, don’t hesitate. It’s still allowed... It’s just fun, and life’s short. 😎

Moana

You're right, it was mentioned in the introduction. But here I’m wondering: should this aspect of the topic (tax fraud) really have a place in a discussion about travel?

And I’m curious if this angle (the possibility of "hiding" money in various ways) was actually picked up or understood by the debaters, since it’s only becoming clear now. To me, it feels like a drift away from the forum’s spirit (if I’m wrong, I’ll "hide" myself...).

--

And there is a link between fraud and the original topic.

This link was even pointed out in the introduction.

Cash isn’t free either.

Cash is profitable... for central banks that create money out of thin air. And financial institutions like commercial banks are forced to borrow, even with low interest rates. The more cash there is, the more it encourages people to consume. So yes, consumers end up in debt for it.

It’s an incentive for fraud...

I wrote this in another discussion thread—someone even dismissed my point rudely. It’s clear that the more cash there is, the more it fuels the underground economy and all kinds of trafficking. The underground economy (drug trafficking, etc.) involves billions of euros. It’s in the interest of governments and central banks to eliminate cash so they can better control money circulation.

Hi there

"The informal economy (drug trafficking, etc.) generates billions of euros"

It still exists, but with risks. Even more profitable now: illegal immigration, smuggler networks, human trafficking of women and children, etc., with fewer risks involved.

I’ll admit, I don’t understand your stress at all.😮

The fact that we’re in a society that forces us to increase our payment methods—and thus the risk of potential "leaks"—actually stresses me out. I found things simpler when I only had a checkbook to check to get an idea of where I stood, and I could travel to the other side of the world without worrying that someone would drain my account using my banking details (just learned today that a large, unexplained withdrawal is happening on my account—cool) or credit card.

You just have to check your card’s website to see where the ATMs are, save them on a site like Maps.me, and boom—done in 2 minutes.

I’ll admit, I didn’t quite get your response here. 😐 Finding ATMs isn’t the issue for me—it’s finding ones that dispense large bills that’s tricky (and I don’t know any site that provides that info).

I think part of your problems comes from the fact that you’re not comfortable with computers.🙂

True, I’m not comfortable with computers—these things that, overnight, can destroy or hand over to a criminal what you’ve entrusted to them. Plus, I’m burned out on passwords. 🏴‍☠️

Hi there,

Even if someone manages to steal your online banking login details, don’t assume they’d drain your account so easily: they’d need to set up an external transfer, confirm it by SMS, and daily transfer limits apply... In some countries—especially in the north or the East—it’s getting tricky to avoid using a card. For example, the other day, I wanted to buy a local SIM card, and I had no choice. Clearly, no one uses cash for that kind of thing anymore.

Michel

...to central banks that create money ex nihilo out of nothing.

A country’s banks don’t just do whatever they want—they’re subject to rules. Adjusting the money supply with the central bank’s approval, in the interest of the economy (of a country), within a well-defined legal framework, when conditions are met, and within authorized debt ratio limits—is that creating money "out of nothing"? No, unless you’re using ambiguous terms. Money creation by banks is therefore part of necessary financial policy; it’s not some reckless gamble.

... you have to set up an external transfer, you need SMS confirmation, the amount of external transfers is capped per day...

Michel

SMS: not necessarily. For example, security can involve reinserting the card into a device and entering a new random "code". You need to have the card. Daily cap: I don’t know about that... I paid for my "little car" in a single transfer from one country to another (EU).

But since I’m not an expert either, I’m just sharing my experience.

The card that only activates after an ATM withdrawal or a PIN payment is for new cards—this way, they’re never sent by registered mail. Everyone avoids those pesky registered letters. There’s always a limit on external transfers, often 5,000 € or 10,000 €.

Michel

The card that only activates after an ATM withdrawal or a PIN payment—that’s for new cards, so they’re never sent by registered mail. Everyone avoids those damn registered letters.

The card that... No relation to the topic.

There’s always a limit on external transfers, often 5,000 or 10,000. Michel

??? Possible, but not my experience. Of course the amount will necessarily be capped because you can’t exceed your balance!! Just kidding.

Could you define "dirty" money for me?

Anything that evades the social contract.

Honest or not in whose eyes?

Citizens who take part in the social contract.

I find it particularly pathetic not to contribute to funding social security, the pension system, the education system, or the various safety nets while still wanting to benefit from them.

Even more pathetic when the lure of profit or the thrill of the game (some cheat just for the fun of it...) isn’t acknowledged.

You’ve got to own it instead of playing the shocked virgin act—like, "It’s not just me, the big guys do it, so why shouldn’t I?"

It’s petty.