Thank You, VoyageForum (page 2 of 2)

Hello everyone,

I’m a travel enthusiast, but not one for "traveler thoughts and reflections"-type discussions—though this time, the topic hits too close to home for me not to chime in:

Given how many messages I’ve posted, it’s clear how much space VF takes up in my schedule... and my life 😉

I’ve made some wonderful "virtual" connections here, some of which have turned into "IRL" meet-ups with people who’ve become friends and travel companions. In fact, I owe VF my biggest thanks for that. 🙂

I’m not a regular in this section, but I also wanted to weigh in on the thread about VF being in danger—only it’s closed now... too bad. Here’s what I wanted to say: I wasn’t part of the original core group, but I’ve still been on the forum for quite a while. About ten years ago, there was already a crisis, which led to debates between supporters of a paid forum and François, who preferred funding it through ads. Since he’s the boss, ads won out, and that meant the appearance of the ad banner on the right and the departure of several major contributors who didn’t agree with this model.

Surprisingly, François was never a fan of those big contributors... he must have his reasons, but what’s certain is that they’re the ones who bring the knowledge. After all, newbies, trip after trip, become contributors themselves. 😉

These "big contributors" get "criticized" for having strong opinions and sometimes responding a bit sharply. But honestly, how could it be any other way when a discussion starts with "I want to go to the American West for 2 weeks—what’s there to see?"—with no politeness, no thanks when someone answers, and no prior research!!!. That’s why some passionate members get tired of receiving unpleasant comments and go silent... while others respond vehemently. 😮

Back to VF’s survival: when ads were introduced, there was a proposal to pay to remove them, but it was rejected. Yet that’s exactly the business model for smartphone apps—you use it for free, you get ads; you pay, you don’t. To me, that seems better than a voluntary contribution because there’s a tangible benefit, which is much healthier. That’s one way to increase revenue.

The other side is expenses—apparently, server costs are exorbitant. The solution here is technical: maybe lighter photos, fewer photos, or partnering with another provider, like separating the forum from the travel journal section... but since I don’t know the business model, I can’t say much more.

Whatever happens, it’s by discussing things that we find, if not the solution, at least a path forward 😉

I don’t know if I should chime in on this discussion, given that I’m a newbie of less than 3 years on VF. Compared to all the 10-plus-year veterans here, I don’t quite measure up... but I’m going to dive in anyway, because I can’t even imagine the impact closing VF would have on those of us—*veteran* survivors—who’ve spent 10, even 15 years browsing this site daily.

For me, it would be a shock—so for you, the veterans, I really can’t even begin to picture it...

Three years were enough to get me hooked on visiting this site multiple times a day, digging through the various sections, though rarely the "Reflections and Thoughts for Travelers" one—it’s where all the tension crystallizes, despite the remarkable voices that post there, some of whom have already spoken up here.

Three years were enough for me to grow attached, through reading countless travel stories, to many people you initially think you only know virtually—but end up knowing better than some folks in your real life. Why? Simply because, through reading travel journals, you feel their passion, their fears, their happiness, their disappointments during what’s a huge part of their lives. Because yes, travel *is* a huge part of our lives! VF might only interest travelers, but for us, it’s essential—thanks to its rich content, its journals, its photos that inspire us to travel again and again, and the generosity of its long-time contributors who are still around.

Three years were enough for me to form a special bond with certain members I chat with regularly outside the forum (via social media, yep 😕), talking about travel, sure, but not just that. I hope the real world will take over from the virtual one someday—I’d love to meet them or share a trip together. All the wonderful people in this community would obviously be missed; the others, a little less. And no other forum could recreate this vibe.

Three years were enough that when I told my wife about VF’s temporary financial struggles, she asked with a smirk if I’d survive, what I’d do without the forum, and how I’d spend my evenings if I wasn’t glued to my computer screen. When I shot back that I’d finally reclaim the TV remote, her expression changed, and she simply wished me... *Long live VoyageForum!* Such a hypocrite, I know, but hey—it’s the thought that counts, right? 😛

So, three years were enough for me to say a big THANK YOU to VoyageForum.

PS: Two little asides I was writing in the other now-closed discussion when I hit publish. The Southern Africa section is really feeling the loss of one of its Big Five—a member whose experience never stopped them from generously sharing tailored advice with newbies like me. Let’s just hope the other Big Five members still around (and who’ll recognize themselves) don’t let themselves fade away. Future travelers will struggle to find anything as detailed in their paper guidebooks—Lonely Planet or Rough Guides—about nearly every reserve in South Africa. If they find even a tenth of what VF offered, they’ll be lucky. But of course, they won’t know what they missed 😕.

It’s too bad VF isn’t adopting the system used by streaming giants (Deezer, Spotify, or Amazon Music) or many smartphone apps—a system that’s proven effective. If you pay a monthly subscription or a fixed fee for Premium access, you’re ad-free. Conversely, since free doesn’t exist, if you refuse to pay, you get bombarded with ads... and often end up switching to Premium. And that doesn’t stop them from setting usage rules and enforcing them for all members, whether they’ve paid or not (this overlaps with Jef’s post, but I’ll leave it as I wrote it Sunday).

Good evening Guillaume,

I also want to thank Voyage Forum.

I’m grateful for: - all the travel info I used to plan my trips; - the amazing travel journals I enjoyed reading and the photos that made me want to visit certain places; - the humor of some members that really made me laugh; - the insightful messages from Jean-Paul ("Cochize").

I’ve met people who became friends 😉 😉

As you said: "I’d obviously miss all the wonderful people in this community, the others a little less, and no other forum could recreate this vibe."

And I enjoy helping people who ask questions about future trips.

See you soon!

Christine

Hi everyone,

Just a little message to thank you warmly for your kind words, touching testimonials, support, encouragement, and positive comments. It really means a lot to read them! 🙂

I’d also like to take this opportunity to thank all of you, on behalf of the whole team, for your participation on the site. We provide the structure and the platform, but you, of course, create the content! 🙂 Without members and their contributions, VoyageForum wouldn’t exist either. So, a huge thank you to all of you for participating and continually enriching the site! 🙂

Rest assured that we’ll do everything possible to keep VoyageForum online. 🙂

Thanks again! 🙂

Best regards,

François, administrator

Hi Jean-François,

A big thank you for your kind words on VoyageForum! 🙂 However, I’d like to clarify a few things about what you mentioned regarding me in your post.

About ten years ago, there was already a crisis that led to discussions between supporters of a paid forum and François, who preferred to fund the forum through advertising. Since he’s the boss, advertising won out, which resulted in the appearance of the ad banner on the right and the departure of a number of major contributors who didn’t agree with this model.

There has always been advertising displayed on VoyageForum—always, from its very first day—and the site has always been funded by ads/sponsors. So I’m not sure which "crisis" or loss of major contributors you’re referring to, since ads have always been on the site (more for visitors and much less for members)... 😕

Also, I’ve never really made a choice about VoyageForum’s funding model in the sense that advertising has always been the only viable way to fund a site where the users (hundreds of thousands of them) create and generate the content. The only exception on the internet—I’m still only talking about sites where all the users provide the content—is Wikipedia, but it’s one of the biggest sites in the world (across all languages and topics) and is funded by major donors like Google and Amazon. Otherwise, the history of the internet has always shown that charging those who contribute content to the site (very different from, say, media sites where content is provided by the site’s team, like journalists) through subscriptions or voluntary contributions has never been enough to cover the costs of a site as large as VoyageForum (including the salaries of the team that runs it). Try to find a single example to prove me wrong... 😛

Surprisingly, François was never a fan of those major contributors...

What are you talking about? I’m sorry, but regarding me, you seem to be off the mark on several points. 😕

Back to VF’s survival: at the time the ads appeared, it was suggested to pay to remove them, but that was refused.

It wasn’t a refusal as such—it’s just that the idea, while it may seem good and appealing, isn’t viable for the business when you consider everything it entails technically and in terms of staffing.

And regarding the apps you mentioned where you can remove ads in exchange for payment (buying the app), know that none of them generate enough monthly revenue—far from it—to host and run a site as large as VoyageForum. Plus, we all know that today, with those infamous ad blockers, paying to avoid ads on a site is practically useless (ad blockers that, by the way, literally kill sites like VoyageForum).

The other aspect is expenses—apparently, the cost of servers is exorbitant. The solution is technical: maybe lighter photos or fewer photos, or partnering with another provider, for example by separating the forum from the travel journal section, etc.

I’ve been designing and hosting websites from A to Z for over 20 years (servers, programming all the features, even the site’s design), so I have some experience in this area. Believe me, unless we decide to delete everything on the site from before, say, 2015 (discussions, public and private messages, profiles, photos, etc.), there aren’t really any places left where we can cut hosting costs. Yes, hosting a site as large as VoyageForum is expensive (a few thousand euros per month, including security systems, CDN servers worldwide, backup servers, renting different databases, etc.), but to be honest, this expense is small compared to the amount needed to pay the salaries of the entire team (which should normally be at least ten people).

--

I’d like to take this opportunity to announce to everyone that I’ll be stepping back from public appearances for a while to focus entirely on programming systems (thousands of lines of code to write) that will hopefully help VoyageForum pull through (all of this, of course, depends on the travel market recovering to some extent). Staying focused on complex programming while making public appearances, which involve responding to many members, has become impossible for me. I have to choose one or the other, and since VoyageForum can’t survive without its technical development and I’m the only programmer at VoyageForum right now, the choice is pretty obvious.

My colleague will handle public appearances as VoyageForum when necessary. But be warned—he’s much more direct, strict, and impatient than I am...! 😏😛😉

Once again, I sincerely thank everyone who has shared suggestions. I see a deep desire to help VoyageForum succeed, and I’m truly and extremely grateful for that.

And thank you again for your thanks, testimonials, encouragement, and kind comments! 🙂 Feel free to continue this discussion by sharing your thoughts about VoyageForum. We read them all very carefully, as they help give deeper meaning to our work. Thanks again! 🙂

Best regards,

François, administrator and founder

Thanks for these insights—they really help clarify how a site like this works.

Oh NO, I REFUSE to even entertain the idea of this forum disappearing—it’s helped me plan amazing trips, meet awesome people on the ground, exchange passionate emails, share laughs online, and dream and reflect through fellow travelers’ stories, and so much more! 🙂 So THANK YOU to VF (and to all of you), and long live VoyageForum! 😇

It’s simple: my first trip was my honeymoon, which made us realize 13 years ago that in just a few hours by plane, we could completely change our environment, culture, and landscapes... It gave us a taste for discovery. And the following year, we decided to go again, alone, and planning that first (well, second😉) trip (Thailand) was when I signed up for VF—a community I’ve never left since. I’ve enriched my profile with all the destinations—I mean *all*—that I’ve prepared using my Lonely Planet and VoyageForum, and in return, I’ve shared my experiences within my limits, not as a regular contributor but by joining discussions when I thought I could add value.

VF is my traveler’s life. Since I have no plans to stop traveling, VF must go on 😛

VF, it’s basically my traveler life. Since I don’t plan on stopping traveling, VF has to keep going

100% agree 🙂

Good evening! :)

I don’t have anything new to add since I relate to pretty much everything that’s been written since your first post. I just wanted to thank you for starting this discussion and to add my modest presence to it. Long live VF!

I rarely post on this forum, but today I just can’t stay silent—VoyageForum feels too precious to all adventurous hearts... VF is a forum that lets our dreams wander freely, one that, with every read, fills me with the wild urge to pack my bags and offers every lucky traveler the chance to feel more alive than ever. VF breathes the spirit of the open road into us. A huge thank you to VF and all its contributors!!

We’re all addicted to VF, and ultimately, we appreciate it because we’d miss it if it were gone. For me, the idea is that, in a way, VF is a public utility site. If it’s facing a temporary difficulty and if the creator wished it, why not all sign a petition—we’re so many—to obtain a subsidy in Quebec or France? After all, subsidies often go to organizations with rather silly purposes. VF is a bridge between France and Canada and a site with quality content. So, I think our real strength lies in our large numbers and our potential mobilization if François needs it. But maybe he’ll manage on his own, and travel will pick up again.

I’m sure some members have significant influence due to their social status; they could help.

I’m very attached to VF’s survival and don’t want some silly Anglo-Saxon site to take over the niche and dumb us down even more.

As a cost-saving measure, I suggest limiting Tatra to 200 messages per day.

Good evening Zorba,

You perfectly sum up what I’m feeling...

I’m a "newbie" on this forum compared to the 10/15 years of "shared life" some members have here.

I’ve met some really friendly people on VF, some of whom guided me in writing my travel journals. I can’t thank them enough!

It’s been a pleasure sharing a few beautiful memories, just as it’s been a pleasure asking for help and support when I needed it.

A big thank you to this wonderful travel community, and a huge thank you to VF for making all these connections possible.

Jourdes

Hi there,

It’s been ten years since I signed up for VF. At first, it was just so I could read quietly, but after a year and a half, I started participating. I find this forum really rich. Few forums cover as many topics. Other travel forums seem pretty basic compared to this one. Since it’s so rich, it attracts a lot of people—both the best and the worst. On some topics, I think, "Wow, they’re so mean!!" On others, "Awesome! What a great idea!" All in all, if I had to sum it up, it’d be positive—even *very* positive. There have been times when I logged in every day, and others when I checked in much less. The "Travelers’ Thoughts and Reflections" section, which was so lively at first, has turned into a bit of a venting space. But you can still share your thoughts politely without getting mobbed (most of the time).

I hope VF has many more great years ahead. Going through a tough period makes you stronger—true in life and for a forum too.

Good luck to those trying to save the site. I’m rooting for them wholeheartedly.

+ 1...........

Thanks for making me laugh, annoy me, sigh, and dream for so many years...........

Yes, long live VoyageForum!!!!!! I won’t repeat—less eloquently—what’s already been said so well before. VF is my daily fix, a fix that makes you dream and warms the heart.

So, how about warming our hearts by coming back? 🙂

You're right, it's dead boring pffffffffff nothing to say about July and August pffff

I just got back from Prague but I don’t really feel like writing a travel journal 😅 I’m reading the forum a bit and I’ll reply to some stuff