So where are they and what are they doing? (page 21 of 33)

Hi Catherine,

Earlier, wandering the streets of Copenhagen, surrounded by all that gentrified bourgeois Europe that flew in on low-cost airlines, strolling around with their eco-moralizing attitudes amid fashion shops and rainbow-flagged international trinket stores, I found myself missing the Russians from Almaty and the Volga Germans from the cities of Temirtau. Deep down, I prefer them. They know who they are, their gender dynamics are more clearly defined—often to the benefit of women, in reality—and they carry something; they look destiny in the face. You might see Islam there, but very often it’s more about Orthodox orientalism. In any case, they’re growing, they’re stirring, and not by looking toward us—except maybe toward a sick man of contemporary history.

Michel

Agnès is about to head to Central Asia, and it’s going to change her in so many ways

I really have no idea what you’re basing that on. Probably just a wild imagination.

Oh, I just came across a cooking show about khachapuri. It made me want to go back to Georgia so badly! Especially since the country seems way cozier than it was 12 years ago.

There’s one country that changed me in so many ways.

The country that’s (or was) probably talked about the most on this forum. The United States. How can people settle there—it’s a mystery!

I really don’t know what you’re basing this on. Probably just an overactive imagination.

I’m basing this on what I know about these countries, their recent developments, and the positions you’ve expressed. We’ll talk about it again later.

Especially since this country seems a lot cozier than it was 12 years ago.

It’s mostly gotten a lot closer to Russia.

Michel

Hi Lillie,

Yeah, Georgia has a lot going for it.

Too bad Putin’s stirring up trouble there to achieve his dream of a greater Russia.

Hi there. This country (which I don’t know much about) is said to be close to Russia, but in what way exactly? Economically, militarily, or tourism-wise—I get that. History’s there, after all. But if it’s about the democratic model, they’re far from progress and moving forward into the future.

based on the positions you express.

Meaning what?

You don’t read travel journals, you’re not interested, that’s something you’ve said over and over.

So how can you know how I travel and what I hope to find in my trips?

My views on different topics aren’t obstacles to my travels. Except for the need to disguise myself to travel, which isn’t the case in the countries I visit.

So how can you know how I travel and what I hope to find there?

You’ve talked about it quite a bit recently.

Apart from the obligation to dress up to travel, which isn’t the case in the countries I’m targeting.

What you call "dressing up" as a requirement only applies to a handful of states, and even then, it’s less strict than you think. Georgians are very hard to figure out—somewhere between Orthodox traditions and a more conventional Eastern mindset. The population is much closer to Russia than to Europe, both in spirit and societal habits. Their impossible-to-learn language isolates them, and Russian remains the language of international communication.

Michel

The country that’s (was) perhaps the most talked about on this forum. The United States. How can one settle there—it’s a mystery?

Personally, between settling in the USA and Georgia, I think I’d still prefer Georgia... And I’m saying this after spending a few months working in Miami. Settling in the USA is sink or swim. If you don’t have two jobs just to get by, if you don’t work like crazy, no one will help you at the slightest existential setback there. At the risk of quickly becoming a fentanyl-addled zombie in homeless neighborhoods.

Hi Lillie,

Yeah, Georgia has a lot going for it.

Too bad Putin is stirring up trouble there to achieve his dream of a greater Russia.

Georgia—a country I really hope to visit someday!

Georgians are very hard to figure out,

But why would you want me to figure out Georgians? I’m not a cop.

and yet, it’s less strict than you think.

Really? There’s no problem walking around in a knee-length dress and hair blowing in the wind in Iran and Afghanistan (the only countries in question)?

Honestly, the media just makes stuff up—they should hire you instead...

Oh really? There’s no problem walking around in a knee-length dress and hair down in Iran and Afghanistan (the only countries in question)? 😮

A knee-length dress—or shorts for men—is pretty inappropriate in a lot of places. That said, it doesn’t *strictly* cause "problems." For your hair, in Iran, they’ll say it’s respected about 70% of the time in cities, not 100% everywhere, and often it’s just elegant scarves over the hair. You’re making a big deal out of two or three countries you wouldn’t even visit, I think.

Michel

Moving to the USA is sink or swim. If you don’t have two jobs just to get by, if you’re not working like a dog, no one will lift a finger to help you if things go south. You risk becoming a fentanyl-addled zombie in homeless neighborhoods fast.

Absolutely.

And more practically, eating well can feel like an obstacle course in some areas. You’ve gotta love junk food... And have the means if you want to eat healthily.

As for housing, it’s often subpar, and insulation? What’s that?

Let’s not even get into the ideology of a growing part of the population or the deep religiosity of many Americans.

You left out racism in your portrait. Between whites (Westerners vs. Latinos), between Black people (long-established vs. "imported"), between every color of the rainbow... Though, let’s be real, that’s everywhere these days.

For your hair, in Iran they’ll say it’s respected 70% of the time in cities—not 100% everywhere—and often it’s just elegant scarves over your hair. You’re making a big deal out of two or three countries you wouldn’t even go to, I think.

Go tell that to Mahsa Amini’s family.

Would you dare?

For your hair, in Iran they’ll say it’s respected 70% of the time in cities—not 100% everywhere—and often it’s pretty elegant headscarves.

... And pushing the limits of intellectual dishonesty even further. But you’d be wrong not to try it just to see how far decency will hold you back. The 30%—are you pulling those stats out of your pointy hat?—who wouldn’t respect it do so at the risk of their lives. And some have paid the price. Have you heard of "Women, Life, Freedom"?

@Attila, don't feed the troll 😕

Given some of the connections these past few days, people who’ve been absent are suddenly logging back in.

There must be some kind of trigger. It’s really sad, all this.

There must be some kind of trigger event

The mailing that was mentioned?

don't feed the thing 😕

I’m struggling to copy Kola’s method—post a message and then disappear. 🙂

There must have been some kind of triggering event

The email mentioned?

No, look a little further back. I don’t feel like talking about it except in hints.

Good evening Agnès, good evening Laurence,

Sometimes, given your reactions, I wonder who I’ve really been talking to here for years. Sure, you read the French official press diligently, sure, you hate it when people question the versions it puts out—but still. Iran is a large state, not a monolithic bloc. There are social classes, a bourgeoisie, an administrative elite, a religious elite, nations, media, and a domestic policy with its own stakes—just like France, for example, which isn’t exactly free from police violence, exploited by both sides. What happened to this young woman is devastating, but it also needs to be read and reported in context, with motives and surrounding circumstances. Saying it’s commonplace in Iran—I don’t think that’s fair. But it did happen, yes.

... And pushing the limits of intellectual dishonesty even further. But you’d be wrong not to try just to see how far decency will stop you.

I’m tired of this way of moralizing at everyone who has a different take on things. It’s a bit too easy—the outraged blame—when it shuts down analysis.

The 30%—did you pull those stats out of your pointy hat?—who don’t comply do so at the risk of their lives. And some have paid the price.

I’ve been to Iran—it was a while ago, admittedly. More recently, quite a few travel videos, street scenes, in public transport, on YouTube or elsewhere. What I saw makes me think 30%. Here too, between a rural area and a bourgeois street, it’s not the same story.

Have you heard of "Women, Life, Freedom"?

No.

Michel