Converting a heavy-duty bus/coach/truck into a motorhome (page 57 of 161)

Hey everyone😉

So what’s this mess all about (to keep it polite)—I’m away from the forum for five days and it goes live?!

Let me start from the beginning. Thanks to Patrick26 for the little note at the end of the photo report from the weekend of Sept. 16/17. Yes, I really appreciate it—it’s nice🙂 to finally have someone think my idea was worth a try (even if it was just a joke😏), and a great one at that . And especially that someone actually made it happen for me. Even though I couldn’t be there, I still feel like I was part of it somehow.

Next:

Congrats to AMAsxmx on the adoption, 😎 don’t worry if you get discouraged at some point—it’s normal. You’ll run into some challenges, but just look at it afterward and tell yourself it’s kind of like your baby. When you finally pull it off, you’ll be so happy and proud😎.

Next:

I absolutely have to share my opinion too (which Patrick26 already knows), but I want to bring it up here:

🤪It’s true that it’s long to read, and it’s also true that I get annoyed searching for something earlier, but...

That’s because there are so many contributors and because it’s FRIENDLY—kind of like a big, long chat between friends. Personally, the post was created in 2004, and I’d already had my eye on my bus for three years. I signed up on the 8th page (the champagne bottle for the driver’s door) because the topic interested me, and I had my bus. I didn’t chime in until the 11th page, once I was out of the DRIRE because before that, I had nothing to share and nothing specific to ask. With the AFNOR guide, the DRIRE file, a bit of knowledge, and some online research, it all works out. 😎

Just to say, I’ve been following this post for two years just because it’s engaging and different from the others🙂—the ones I barely visit anymore, at least not to contribute (too many tangents, too many posts to follow). So if you want to change this one, be careful not to strip it of its origin, its warmth, and turn it into a soulless DRIRE branch with legal text links, photo links, and pre-defined templates ready to copy-paste. Because then you’ll only get visitors who come to "GRAB" a standard layout, a pre-formatted setup, etc., without even leaving a little thank-you, and that’ll gently "kill" this post, which is currently turning into a FRIENDLY GROUP.

WARNING: I’m AGAINST posting the AFNOR Guide online since it’s copyrighted, which would mean closing the post . Plus, it’s not like I had it with me when I went to Véritas—my setup was approved for 85 €, which is RIDICULOUS compared to the cost of the conversion. 😉 That said, I’m not against gathering all the useful texts, standards, and shareable info. If it keeps the post free for exchanging ideas or even goofing around without worrying about space, why not.

Patrick had a great idea introducing SJunior, who I think will help keep this post alive—though hello, the solicitation...😄

Okay, I’ve gone on long enough😕. Sorry, but it’s been five days since I last wrote anything...

I’ll add one more thing since while I was writing, new posts popped up: For metal sheets in the joints, it’s common. I even added 3mm plywood over a window with Trisodur in between😛... elastic seal, right?😏 For the metal sheet in the joint, I think you need to add a welded border all around or better yet, 5 or 8mm plywood glued to the metal (regulates humidity and provides a base for attaching insulation and the rest while insulating it from the metal). Not a bad idea, huh?

And for plywood and tiling in a bus—total nonsense. A bus deforms and twists while driving, so drywall won’t hold, and you definitely don’t want moisture setting in. It’s like insulating with fiberglass or rock wool—it compresses with vibrations, everything shifts gently, clumps at the bottom, and creates thermal bridges at the top. Plus, it absorbs moisture.

GX47

Hello,

And what about the pee situation in all this? Quick poll (super synthetic, cold, and all 😛 but still important):

What system? For what use? (number of people and frequency of use) What advantages? What drawbacks?

Don’t hold back—share your experience if you’ve tried alternative solutions, even if it wasn’t in a bus...

What do you think of systems like these:

http://www.sun-mar.com/products/mobilestraightback12volt.php http://www.envirolet-europe.com/wscfrench.html

Okay, it costs more than AMAsxmx’s bus, but at least with this, it won’t be for nothing when we say "I’m off to the throne" hahahahabofbofbof—well, it’s late, you’ll understand I couldn’t resist...

See ya, Seb

It's aluminum of the same thickness as the original glass.

Uh... there's an error at the end of my previous post—it should say:

"AND for the plasterboard and tiling" and not "AND for the plywood" which stays in place well (elastic)

Sorry

Hello, and thanks.

By the way, I'm mad at you..... After you missed the meet-up on Saturday ??/??/2006. I was hoping to meet you at the gathering on the 17th, but you cowardly abandoned us.😉

So catch you next time.

Otherwise, do you have any models you can recommend based on a chassis that I can find for not too expensive? (best value for money, you know!)

See you soon and thanks.

Hey, for the partitions I'm going to use 40mm expanded polystyrene and cover it with 8 or 10mm plywood on both sides. It absorbs vibrations and it's lightweight. What do you think?

Hi jose6440,

There's no point in insulating between two sections.

Make some battens out of poplar plywood, 40mm wide by 19mm thick. Glue them with wood glue and screw them down. Then attach your panels (8 or 10mm thick) — glued and screwed to the battens. This lets you run electrical wires, switches, and outlets through them.

If you look at the photo, you can see on the right and left partitions where the switch wires come out.

Hey,

polystyrene in a vehicle isn't ideal. don't let it rub (horrible noise) - you really need to glue it on both sides or leave some space. it tends to trap a bit of moisture. the advantage is it's cheap

😉a link might be useful for some, the first original with all the pages the second in French🤪 if you want http://www.stefan-bauer.de/302-2.htm http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=fr&sl=de&u=http://www.stefan-bauer.de/302-2.htm&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=1&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.stefan-bauer.de/302-2.htm%26hl%3Dfr%26lr%3D%26sa%3DG

I'm going to mess this up again..... sorry!

Our habitable vehicles must conform to classifications M0, M1, or M2! (see the AFNOR guide) for interior fitouts regarding flame non-spread and toxic fumes.

No polystyrene is classified! When exposed to flame it melts immediately, ignites, and releases toxic vapors (styrene I believe, namely!)

Raw wood is only classified from 40 mm thickness (4 cm!) if it's planed on 4 sides (and even then, it's only classified as M3... and only in vertical sections)

and that's where the headaches start!

For thin wood to be classified, it must be veneered (not paper veneer, only laminate) and on 2 faces! even if the 2nd face is the interior of the partition!

All edges must be protected from potential flame exposure (veneered edges, glued edges, embedded in edge strips, profiles, etc.)

The only other alternative is paint or varnish over your choice of primer that will 'rate' the wood for fire resistance. Only one manufacturer: Lurie.

It costs a fortune! My last order for a booth—20 liters, €1,420!.... but the wood was classified M1!

That's why all interiors made by manufacturers are in laminates or varnished wood!

Very few furniture pieces from sellers like BUT, Conforama, Atlas, or others can be suitable!

Be careful during your Veritas and Mines inspections!

Nowadays, as we know, anything can pass! It depends on the competence of the Veritas inspector and the Mines inspector. But in case of a problem, in court, at some point you'll be asked the famous question: "Sir, why did you use materials that current regulations forbade?" "Do you realize the damage caused by your DIY work?" And then, what do you answer? That the Veritas and Mines guys didn't say anything? If they're questioned, they'll say it wasn't visible that the panels were covered, etc....

For insulation, there aren't 50 solutions. Certain thin films are classified (not all! Some have foams that prevent classification) Green Styrodur is classified Other products in sheet form exist with fire classifications.

Be careful not to choose a product that insulates well against temperature but will trap moisture (like glass wool for example). Nothing like that to kill a van!

But be careful—a bus body, over 12 meters, flexes as it moves and your panels will cause rubbing against the metal sheets (rub Styrodur on metal, you'll hear the noise! It's like a fingernail on a chalkboard!)

So the ideal remains thin films! They can be stapled, glued, taped, applied in 2 crossed layers, etc... (but everyone does as they like!)

I warned you at the beginning of the post..... sorry!

For the post with photos of the German bus—be careful! They don't have the same regulations as us!

If you want to convert a vehicle, it's not necessarily complicated, but the first step is to order the AFNOR guide "Converting a Recreational Vehicle". Half of what I know is in there!

For the other half, I'm not stingy, and besides there's the forum and all the contributors.

PATRICK26

Hi everyone,

I worked at an RV dealership where I changed quite a few rear panels of factory-made RVs from a major French brand (the most well-known one that makes 2 brands near Valencia, won't name it!!) and what's more, they leaked water even though the vehicles were brand new!!!

And surprise: these factory RVs don't have to meet AFNOR standards!!

Composition of the walls from outside to inside: Polyester laminate gelcoat at 2–3mm A layer of polystyrene (you know, the stuff with little balls that makes thick black smoke when it burns!) About 25–30mm And a 4mm layer of plywood that burns pretty well too!! covered with a decorative finish layer.

One question: did this manufacturer submit these vehicles to Bureau Veritas or does it have fire-resistant polystyrene and polyester?

Have you ever seen a recent caravan that caught fire? there's nothing left of it! except the chassis and wheels.

So that's just to say that buying a brand new RV for 30,000 euros minimum (at that price you should be able to build yourself a nice camper van!) doesn't necessarily mean you're safe from the slightest problem, and they're pushing it a bit with safety standards (that's just my personal opinion!)

Long live plywood, which is a great material (or...) and which in nautical applications for example passes AFNOR standards without any issues!!!

Hi, so if I understand correctly, you need wood veneered on both sides or varnished wood for my partitions, but what thickness for the rest and to stay within code and at a reasonable weight? AS FOR THE INSULATION FILM YOU MENTIONED; does it come in a glossy form like aluminum foil with several stacked layers (7, 10, 13 layers)? Fab

Me, when I go through the mines inspection, I don't call myself the 'Trigano group's homologation services'!

And if they do, it's because the trim in front of the polystyrene must be fire-classified.... (I have no idea!)

So I stick to AFNOR and the regulations currently in force!

Now, as I've already said, there's not a single mines engineer or Veritas inspector who knows the standards perfectly! So with that, good luck knowing which rules to follow!

Me, given the choice, I go with what's simplest for me. I don't want polystyrene. I prefer multi-layer. Which is fine because it's thinner, insulates better, doesn't make noise, doesn't hold moisture, and it's fire-classified! Why complicate things! 😕

For the partitions, same deal. I prefer working with laminated panels. It's washable, it looks good, the finish is applied at the same time as the panel, and it's fire-classified! (Plus I've got leftover stock from my old trade show days!) 😕

But everyone does what they want! Me, my bible (or my Quran, take your pick), is AFNOR and the texts that start with CE- and numbers after.

The "someone told me," "the other guy did," "you'll see," "don't sweat it" and others—in the business I was in (trade shows, so public-facing design work!), I've known people who used them. None of them lived trouble-free.

In my company, we never had a safety inspection that went badly! And we always delivered the shows before opening. But we never cut corners. If the specs or standards required this or that, well we did it. Period.

It's the zero-hassle choice.

For my bus, same deal. I want Veritas and the mines inspection to be a formality. Nothing more.

I'll remind you that we're on a forum, that I'M the resident smartass, and that it's ME who's always reminding everyone that there are rules! 😉

After that, everyone does as they please.... (as the song says!)

PATRICK26

The thickness doesn't matter for the fire rating! It's the laminate that determines the fire rating. Wood thickness will give the wall its stiffness.

For the varnish, use only a specific varnish for fire-classing wood, brand "Lurie". Search online.

For insulation, I used 5-layer (which is indeed multi-layer aluminum film). The first layer is laid down and glued against the outer metal sheet (from the inside, of course!), everywhere it's possible: on the sides and roof, between the frame arches of the body.

For the second layer, we keep it simpler—we glue it to the lining panels before installing them, so it covers the entire interior surface.

Between the two layers, I have 3.5 cm of air space.

PATRICK26

hey patrick...

and the soundproofing! does it work?

When I talk about the thickness of the wood, it's to avoid the bus's enemy: "weight" — for the rest, I understand.

AMAsxmx: (but when do you sleep?) For soundproofing, it's -39 dB per layer with my 5 layers.

Did I answer your question well?

peccin: As for weight, it's the enemy of light vehicles. In our heavy vehicles, while it's not your friend, it's something we can work with. If you go with 8 or 12mm thickness, everything will be fine.

PATRICK26

Hey Patrick, hi everyone, Me sleep early?!! Whoaaa🤪!! The excitement keeps me from sleeping, I can't even lie down😕 But I still disconnected before you😛!

- 35db is solid. I'm not there yet (soundproofing), but it's always good to know!

CLICK CLICK: save the answer with copy-paste via Word, to my motor-home folder, in the soundproofing subfolder! Ha ha ha, not bad thinking, trucker😉😉!! That's my way of breaking down the posts that interest me! I thought of it a bit late, but I think I'll reread the posts from the first page and collect all the good info! That way I'll know everything about YOU!!!!

WOUAAHAHAHAHAHA hehehehehehehehehehehehehehehehe

Since we're talking about partitions, some buses have domed roofs and for the cutting... how do we do it without fitting it first? Should we make a cardboard template, or does someone have a brilliant solution? FAB

Hello,

So what about pee and poop in all this? Quick little survey (very synthetic and straightforward 😛 but it's important anyway):

what system? for what use? (number of people and frequency of use) what advantages? what disadvantages?

Don't hesitate to reply if you've tested alternative solutions, even if it wasn't in a bus...

What do you think of systems like this:

http://www.sun-mar.com/...raightback12volt.php http://www.envirolet-europe.com/wscfrench.html

OK, it costs more than the AMAsxmx bus, but at least with that, it's not for nothing we say "I'm heading to the throne" hahahahabofbofbof anyway, it's late, you'll understand that I couldn't resist...

catch you later, seb

Hello,

Well, I'll ask and answer the questions myself!

what system? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> macerating toilet

for what use? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2 people full-time!

what advantages? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Small evacuation pipes compared to a conventional system

what disadvantages? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1 Power consumption: around 16A. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2 Makes a lot of noise. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3 Doesn't accept anything except waste and toilet paper (well, after all, that's the main thing)

Note: Since I don't have a bus yet, I'm talking about my apartment's toilets. Those using this system in a bus might see other advantages/disadvantages?

catch you later, seb