What are the criteria that make you choose one destination over another? (page 7 of 10)

But I think there are several of us in this case...

No doubt, but against science, against anthropology, against sociology. I’ve known you to be more scientifically minded.

Is freedom a norm and a purely French concept?

Freedom? The least one can say is that it’s only a French value by misunderstanding. It’s collective, abstract freedom. When it comes to freedom, in Europe, France is pretty much at the bottom of the class. You’re sending me down a path that some won’t be able to follow; I can explain all this, but it’s really no longer the topic of discussion—it’s going to upset the purists.

Michel

Is freedom a norm and a purely French custom?

It’s possible that most people in this country feel free. After all, we don’t know much about how they truly feel unless we sense a spirit of revolt, like in Iran, for example.

When it comes to freedom, in Europe, France is pretty much at the bottom of the class.

It’s clear that in Viktor Orbán’s pro-Soviet Hungary, the term *freedom* really takes on its full meaning...

You’re sending me down a path some won’t be able to follow; I can explain all that,

hmm, I see where you’re going with this. You’re about to trot out that old chestnut about how one person’s freedom ends where another’s begins?

Freedom is a standard and a purely French custom? (I don’t know why I’m asking this question—I feel like this discussion is going to take a turn again... 😏)

Everyone knows full well that France is a highly centralized country politically, economically, and socially. In short, most decisions are made in Paris. So in a way, that explains it. And it’s a country, a nation that has always struggled to find unity, in my opinion. Some people on the forum—you know who you are—criticize France while still living here. 😉 So if you don’t like a country, shouldn’t you go somewhere else? Might as well move to Pattaya, put your feet up, and have a bowl of rice—that’s enough to live on.

Hello,

It’s certain that in Viktor Orbán’s pro-Soviet Hungary, the term freedom takes on its full meaning...

Can you seriously name one single point that shows less freedom in Hungary than in France? What could possibly convince a traveler to avoid the country due to freedom restrictions? Do you see a difference compared to France in recent years when it comes to freedom of expression, bodily autonomy, freedom of movement, or entrepreneurship? I don’t. But have you been there often? Hungary isn’t liberal in its state principles, and for that reason, I prefer the Czech Republic, for example. But not to the point of avoiding Hungary altogether—especially since, in terms of cuisine and atmosphere, it’s really much better.

Are you going to trot out that old cliché about how one person’s freedom ends where another’s begins?

What I mean is that in France, we have a very intellectual and abstract conception of freedom—one that projects it onto ideals without putting it into practice. I prefer the Anglo-Saxon approach: pragmatic, individualistic, and with less state intervention.

And it’s a country, a nation that, in my opinion, has always struggled to find unity.

Absolutely. It’s a state—centralized and fairly authoritarian—that intellectually conceives itself as a nation through adherence to universalist principles. This largely explains its current precarious position in the world, which isn’t without consequences (and, in my view, this is just the beginning) for travelers. Proudly brandishing the power of a passport is pretty misleading if, in reality, you can’t actually use it.

The cliché you mentioned is nonsense for little kids.

Besides, do you think travelers from other countries really ask themselves whether they’ll avoid a country based on grand principles and good intentions? I don’t get that impression—at least, I haven’t heard much feedback along those lines.

Michel

(I don’t know why I’m asking this question, I have a feeling the discussion is going to go off the rails again...Smartypants)

If only I had that kind of luck with lottery numbers...

I never play the lottery, but don’t worry—we’ll try to refocus your topic. It often goes like this: we stray off course and then come back... only to stray again. Whether you reply to my messages or not doesn’t really matter to me

After reading your "motivation questionnaire" about choosing a destination, a question immediately came to mind: On this forum, especially since its revival, it seems most active members have gotten considerably older... Those who haven’t returned are mostly younger, and now the over-50s are in the majority. Sure, a significant percentage doesn’t display their age in their profile (wonder why?), but you can still get a sense of it. (Their age ) We’re more or less dinosaurs here (me for sure!)... Over the years, our way of thinking, approaching the world, and therefore our way of traveling changes... or at least it should (more or less quickly). That applies to everyone, I think? The world doesn’t look the same at 20 as it does at 73. Besides, the more you’ve traveled, the more limited your choices (of countries) become—since you’re only considering countries, not potential regions within the same country... I don’t really like the Paris region or the north of France, but I’d happily go back to Corsica or the Basque Country... So rather than going to Saudi Arabia or Qatar, which I’ll probably never visit, I’d prefer to return to other regions of Colombia or Romania.

I’ll try to answer your questions with this new perspective.

Price

If you’re talking about flight tickets, no—the price doesn’t matter to me since I travel economy and can afford any destination... and do so several times a year. But if someone offers me a free flight to Antarctica, I’m not going—I’m not interested in penguins, and besides, no one lives there (no humans). I also don’t want to go back to China, especially not these days!

When it comes to accommodation prices, yes—comfort, though slightly more important with age, isn’t a big factor for me. I sleep well anywhere, I’m not really bothered by noise, and since I only spend the night there, the accommodation doesn’t matter much. My luxury? A hearty breakfast (my most important meal of the day). And for that, long live Eastern European countries! (Romania, Bulgaria, etc.) and the human connections with hosts or property owners. I love talking and chatting with them. I don’t like the concrete of big hotels; I prefer modest guesthouses, "bed and breakfast"-style lodgings that blend into semi-urban, rural, or mountain landscapes. Bamboo and palm-thatched huts by the sea (no corrugated iron roofs!)—those are almost impossible to find now. Mountain refuges (not Mont Blanc!). And all of that with a good quality-to-price ratio, when possible. After all, everyone sets their own bar for comfort, luxury, etc.

A magazine article, TV report, travel journal, or Instagram ad?

That’s never been a factor for me, and it never will be—what draws me to travel is always a certain need for discovery, a taste for the unknown. So, as much as possible, I try not to copy other people’s trips. I’ll see a few "must-sees" when the opportunity arises—not all of them. But I don’t refuse a nice accommodation tip if it fits what I’m looking for...

Ease of travel

It wasn’t before, but it’s become more of a concern... especially the fear of kidnappings, assaults, abductions, or murders. I was particularly affected by the cowardly murder of a guide from Nice in Algeria (for example). I’m also increasingly wary of problems with authorities in certain countries (what happened to some French travelers in Iran makes me think twice). The issues I had in China—arrest, police station, fines—also stick with me.

Minimal time difference?

I’m becoming more sensitive to that too, which makes me hesitate to go to Australia or New Zealand. Actually, it’s not the time difference that bothers me but the flight duration... I’m close to considering business class.

The country with the most commonalities for all trip participants?

Not really, no.

Activities?

Yes, a little, though it’s not a must. I need mountains, wild places, and—since I love trekking and hiking—what I call "spaces of freedom" where you don’t need a ticket to enjoy NATURE. That’s why I’ve grown to love Eastern European countries like Bulgaria, Albania, and Romania in recent years: their "national parks" are hard to access by vehicle, with no facilities, no required permits, no fences, no restrictions... It’s free and open to those who earn it... The sea for snorkeling or diving (which I barely do anymore)... Unfortunately, there are no healthy coral reefs left on the planet; everything’s destroyed or nearly so. When you’ve seen the difference over time, it’s just a fact (I’m not exaggerating). I regret discovering the sea late—I mean, the sea as a sailor, navigator, on my own boat—because those are the people I admire and respect the most. For me, the sea (along with high mountains) remains one of the last spaces of freedom... But lack of opportunity? Courage? Not really a sea leg? A bit of all that made me realize I missed out on something important. I was a private pilot, but flying was never a space of freedom for me—too many constraints! I gave up the controls pretty quickly...

Relaxation?

Yes, from time to time—to let my thoughts wander, enjoy my surroundings, admire, and feel... I prefer that to the hustle, the "activity" binge like swimming with dolphins, or trying to do/see everything at the risk of drowning in crowds.

The desire to push yourself?

Not really. The pleasure of discovery, yes... sometimes that might have led me to push myself, but the goal was always different. I used to seek challenge in competitive sports, which brought me a lot of joy, but travel, for me, is something else entirely. Nothing to do with sports or self-improvement.

A photo?

Since I got a phone, I take a few pictures... For years, I didn’t take any photos, preferring to keep my memories inside. Every time I came back from a trip, the first question was: "Did you take any photos?"

To complete the picture.

What I’ve only done once and will never do again: following a set itinerary, fully planned in advance with daily stages and pre-booked accommodations (not all, thankfully!). No way to go off track, change my mind, stay longer than planned, or leave a place I don’t like... what a nightmare! The anti-travel!

The only time I relapsed and booked accommodation was in Albania. The reason? My wife and I had planned a day-long trekking trip, and given the possible fatigue and likely lack of lodging at the end, we booked a guesthouse. Bad luck—on the day of departure, violent storms forced us to abandon our hike. Normally, the room cost would’ve been charged, but after explaining the situation to the host, he didn’t take a cent. Hats off to the Albanian! My travel flaws: - I hate private property (I mean when it spans hundreds of hectares or more with no right of way)... I trespass out of mischief... - I love sneaking in—not for financial reasons, but for the thrill of pulling it off 😉 Example: To get to Machu Picchu, I cut through the forest with no guarantee of success and ended up in the middle of the site... In Nepal, I went trekking without a permit several times just for the fun of dodging checkpoints. I love finding the little alley that lets me skip the toll at Bhaktapur or Kathmandu’s Durbar Square. When there’s a monument to visit, I sometimes enter through the exit... I know, it’s not good, don’t do it...

To add to that:

So far, I’ve avoided countries with cold, wet climates (oceanic climate). The cold doesn’t bother me, but rain, drizzle, and fog—I really don’t like them. And since I’m often on foot when traveling, having to wear a raincoat is a hassle. So, no (or at least not yet) Norway, Iceland, Scotland, etc... Plus, I imagine (probably wrongly) that the people in these countries aren’t very outgoing. Restaurants, bars, and shops must close early in the evening, and that would bother me...

Can you seriously give me one single point that shows less freedom in Hungary than in France?

Just one? Seriously? Too easy, mate. Let’s say freedom of the press (RSF 2023 World Press Freedom Index): France: 24th place (1) Hungary: 72nd place

But hey, RSF is just a bunch of activists (who knows, maybe they even use inclusive writing).

(1) Not too shabby for a country you recently wrote about "in France, the press is the State"

Hey Mathews, 🙂

It’s clear that in Viktor Orbán’s pro-Soviet Hungary, the term freedom takes on its full meaning...

Never forget that the freedom we envision is based on a misunderstanding. It’s a collective, abstract kind of freedom.

Hey Voyajou, I agree 🙂 But freedom isn’t just abstract—it’s also the ability to go wherever you want, in short, to travel, right...?

I wonder if, if I had started a thread about your favorite foodie destination, there would have been a reply like this:

But freedom isn’t just abstract—it’s also the ability to go wherever you want, in short, to travel

I’ll give it a shot soon...😛

Hi Agnès, Mathews, Jean Luc,

All that energy spent criticizing ends up reinforcing the analysis. The topic is indeed—I’m not off-topic at all—about whether we can choose or avoid a destination based—among other things—on the moral judgments we hold about the laws a nation adopts. I think it was Kola who brought up this idea. If you believe that’s possible, I can see how taking a reflective look at what constitutes your own national framework might be tricky. Maybe even impossible. No big deal.

Michel

if we can choose

No.

The subject is me.

Mathews, Voyajou, and Kola share generalities. Do they choose their destinations based on moral judgments? I don’t know.

Lillieone, yes. She answered in that vein. Actually, in a second step, as if this criterion was so obvious she hadn’t mentioned it first or as if it wasn’t essential?

I answered too. And I didn’t include it in my list of examples or really in my reply because I know how it ends here when these issues come up... They take over everything else, and the thread turns into a eloquence contest, a battle for the under-40 crowd. Those who just want to participate in the original topic flee, and all that’s left are the debaters who can fill pages without ever getting tired. I used to take part in those. It’s fun, stimulating, but over time, it’s mostly become redundant.

You answered the generalities. I think this criterion isn’t on your list when you choose, but you didn’t clearly say so.

I answered too. And I didn’t include it in my list of examples or really in my answer because I know how it ends up here when these issues come up... They take over everything else and the topic turns into a debate contest, a battle for the under-40 crowd.

Ah, I see. So it’s a survey or an inventory, then. We should think about using a Forms tool.

Michel

No, this is a discussion between travelers.🙂

(And not a peanut-flipping contest. You didn’t answer my question...)

You didn’t answer my question...😇)

What question?

Michel

. I think this criterion isn't on your list when making your choice, but you didn’t clearly state it.

There you go.

That’s what I call a question.

A clarification if you want.

I think this criterion isn’t on your list when making a choice, but you didn’t clearly state it.

The answer is no, then. Thirty years ago, I might’ve had that kind of principle, but I’ve managed to move past it.

Michel

Hello,

Over time, my choice of travel has become very simple as I’ve grown older. A country of moors, deserts, silence—if it rains, if there’s mist, that’s perfect. A place where time seems to slow down and people take the time to chat. Preferably seasons of frost, January, February, March on our continent, for the endless pleasure of snuggling into the chosen dwelling. And above all, no more 15-day or three-week marathons. And especially, no more piling up new countries. Explore one country—or even just one region—again and again. I probably haven’t listed all the criteria, but that’s not really a big deal. 😉