Converting a heavy-duty bus/coach/truck into a motorhome
FR

Translated into English.

AL Aled ·
Alright, I wasn't clear when I reread what I wrote....

I want to replace my two rear side windows with aluminum plates, but without welding or riveting them—just fitting them into the window seals instead. I'm trying to minimize heavy work and make it reversible (.....why?.... just in case...) Has anyone done this? Will this actually hold up? Thanks in advance.
BU Burgman ·
Hi, I'd like some information on type approval and the vehicle inspection, thanks
burgman 65
SE Setraforever ·


Hi everyone,

I'm brand new to VoyageForum and I'm hoping you folks can help me out with some advice. I just acquired a Setra bus that used to belong to a school transportation company. It's in good condition, and I just got the DRIRE paperwork, but there are no specs listed for the gas and electrical systems. Can you help me out? Does someone need to verify the work before the inspections? I'd like to keep the bus set up with 24 volts—are there compatible isolation relays available? Thanks to everyone!
CH Christian06 Veteran ·
Hi

Regarding 24 volts, I have experience with a boat that was equipped with 24 volts (starters, alternators, pumps, and various lights)

This 24 volts was stored on 12-volt batteries wired in series.

The previous owner had added loads of 12-volt equipment, and to get that 12 volts, he'd tapped directly into the terminals of one of the 12-volt batteries. Well, big problem 😕 because after several discharge and recharge cycles through the alternators, the batteries wouldn't charge anymore and the voltages on the batteries were too weak.

Here's what was actually happening: by using the 12 volts from one battery, you discharge it, and you end up with one battery more discharged than the other; when the alternator recharges both batteries together at 24 volts, the battery that wasn't used for the 12 volts reaches full charge before the other, and then resists the flow of charging current, leaving the second one poorly charged; then you reuse the 12 volts and increase the voltage imbalance between the 2 batteries even further, and so on until the point where the voltage on the 2nd is so weak that you can't recharge it anymore. It's dead 😠

After ruining several 140 amp-hour batteries 😮, I was happy to finally understand what was going on, and I solved the problem by buying a 24V/12V converter module 😏 and connecting all the 12-volt equipment to that module. No more problems since then.

Christian
CHRISTIAN

"Ne pas rire, ce n'est pas sérieux"
SE Setraforever ·
Thanks Christian, I'm also planning to install only 24V nominal devices to avoid charge returns. Plus, this lets me connect the 24V ground to the bus chassis to save on wiring—that wasn't possible at 12V because when the 2 batteries are in series, the ground of one is the + of the other, so you can't connect all the grounds to the chassis without causing a short circuit.

By the way, do you know the electrical rules for certification and standards?

Thanks! 🙂
NA NaecoBuddy ·
my new site is officially open

http://bus.benhurd.net

I'm noting the address, I'll follow this project with interest :o

It's the same as mine, just bigger, you could say 😉
faites de votre 205 un camping-car
BU Burgman ·
Thanks for the information, have a good day
burgman 65
SE Setraforever ·
Hi everyone, does anyone have information about the NFS56200 standard for gas and electricity? Which organizations carry out inspections and issue certificates of conformity?

Thanks in advance
SA Saen ·
Hi, I wanted to know if anyone has any info about the DRIRE being privatized in July?! Will the procedures change?! Will they still accept going from TCP to VASP?! According to a friend you'll have to use a 'fitter' but I don't know any more! Anyway, good luck to you all
PA Patrick26 Veteran ·
HELLO,

the DRIRE services remain as they are today!

only technical testing centers have been handed over (annual truck inspections and semi-annual bus inspections). (the equivalent of automotive technical centers, but for heavy vehicles)

for conformity tests, registration modifications, and isolated receptions, it will still be the DRIRE that handles it, not the technical control centers!

you have to draw the parallel with a light vehicle: for modifications, you go to the DRIRE, for technical inspection, you go to Autosur, Dekra, etc... and well it will be the same for heavy vehicles.

bye, bye...

PATRICK26
SA Saen ·
Ok, thanks Patrick for the info!! So I'm heading off to buy my S53, which like many people here I want to convert into a motorhome. I'm hoping to have everything finished by the end of summer – both the DIY work and the paperwork. I do have one little hesitation though – it's the high fuel consumption (I've been told it uses about 25L per 100km)?! But after weighing up the pros and cons, I reckon I'm going to let myself be tempted anyway!!!!!! Have a good journey everyone!!!!
SP Sputnick Regular ·
raflou: the driver's door issue comes up in certain conditions during certain inspections—it depends on who's checking. PATRICK26 ran into this. For a project over €10,000, they definitely look more closely... I'm just pointing out that I passed the DRIRE inspection with my S45 without a driver's door back in 2002 or 2003... thony, elylous, PATRICK26, a coach fitted out as VASP is drivable with a commercial license AND TCP license. I have a letter to that effect from the prefecture and I drive with a TCP (D) license with a VASP...

peyolt: you need to go through the DRIRE in your home department. But if you have a buddy who gives you proof of residence in Trifouillis-les-Chépères, you're all set. (that's what I did)

setraforever: hey, for standard 56200 and the new EU regulations, you need to call AFNOR in La Défense (92)—the book cost about €15 back in '98...

lionmasta: yeah, domain sales are interesting, especially without an engine, the price will be dirt cheap. Watch out for anyone wanting to buy a coach to drive through domain sales—in general they don't provide registration docs even though it's theoretically possible to get a new one. (very difficult)

GAVIN: for collector insurance, I've already left info on that, but you just need to check the Yellow Pages, it's easy!

ZOLUX: if you remove the seats, you still need to pass the inspection to register it as a commercial vehicle, otherwise you need the TCP license—even if in practice it might work, no guarantees!

Anyway, quick reminder: for manufacturer approvals, you need to call the brand's dealer (don't call headquarters!) to find plans for bus conversions, call the transport companies in your region... an S45/53 consumes between 20 and 25 liters per 100 km. to get the license, there are paid trainings through AFT IFTIM—don't ask ANPE, they're out of the loop. don't hesitate to call the DRIRE automotive department in your region, they're there to help people too! the first step is knowing what you want to do, buy a vehicle, put together the file for the inspection (DRIRE), research the regulations (56200 and EU standards for buses), make plans or know exactly what you're doing, do the work, pass inspection by an expert like Véritas, then comes the final inspection at the end of the process...
BA Balek ·
Hey there, I also want to buy a bus, but right now I'm stuck on insurance .............if anyone has an address or a website, that would help me ............... thanks in advance and good luck to everyone...........
never stop techno music
DA Danmetz57 ·
Reading these regulations honestly just makes you want to scrap the whole thing. When I look at all these conversion requirements, I wonder if you've all actually had to deal with the DRIRE inspectors.

I've been told that a vehicle can get impounded on the spot if it's inspected while the conversion hasn't been officially certified (load rating, doors, fixtures, gas, electricity, insulation, etc.). Has that actually happened to any of you?

Does anyone know a way to make life easier when it comes to regulations and the authorities, without risking having your vehicle stopped at the first inspection?

I'm planning to convert a Renault Master flat-floor cab equipped with a 20m³ moving van body. I already have a passage between the cabin and the back, a side door, and a large rear door that can both be opened from inside.

Thanks in advance to everyone for your responses.
BA Balek ·
Hey, me too, I'm converting a bus but I'm running into some problems. I'm trying to fill out the MINE file but I'm having some difficulties... 1. Where can you get the "Specimen of the vehicle description notice"? 2. How do you create the "Diagram with marked position references"? If someone has an example, that would be really helpful (to see what it looks like). 3. Do you absolutely need the manufacturer's authorizations for any potential weight or dimension overages mentioned in the vehicle description notice, as well as for any possible modifications such as: etc... when I don't want to change anything about the bus's dimensions or weight? That's it, thanks in advance for your replies.
never stop techno music
GU Guedin ·
Hey, regarding the driving license, at the prefecture they contacted the ministry and told me that a VASP requires a heavy goods vehicle (PL) license, period. Did you get stopped when leaving TekOs?
guedin
SP Sputnick Regular ·
yes, often and elsewhere too, no problem. despite the VASP mention, you're driving a coach, everything's fine. it's a pretty technical issue, nobody's going to give you grief over it. proof: I went and asked the police about it, and they're completely clueless!
RémyS53R ·
Hey balek, I can only help you with the "Specimen of the vehicle descriptive notice", but it still depends on your bus brand... I went with a Saviem/Renault S53R, it's awesome value for money... and I had a little problem with my file because it was missing that famous vehicle descriptive notice, more commonly called the "red-marked form"... I contacted RVI, they pointed me to Irribus, which is Renault's bus division. I made my request for declassification authorization, and while I was at it I asked them to provide me with a specimen of the red-marked form. You just have to give them the number in the type series...

So I hope this can help you, and if I can help you with other truck-related stuff, I'd be happy to!!!

Rémy...

Long live free underground music...
voyager en bus camping car, pure aventure ! ! ! ! les rêves sont faits pour être réalisés…
RémyS53R ·
Hi Sputnik,

Nice thread! Shame we can't see much in the photo—is it an S45 or S53, the "M" versions if I'm right? I've got a buddy who had an S45 with 1,200,000 km on it. Engine was replaced at 300,000 km, technically inspected, immaculate maintenance log... the crazy thing is the bus!

I've got a quick question—do you know if it's possible to drive a bus registered for passenger transport with a Category C license, as long as you don't carry more than 9 people? I was thinking about downgrading mine to a heavy vehicle to stay legal while I'm doing the conversion work and to be able to travel with it for 7 summers (legally)... But if it turns out it's legal to drive a bus with no more than 9 people on board with a Category C license, that's perfect—saves me time and money...

I hadn't thought of it before, but I read a post from Bemoit on the site saying it was possible and especially "legal"...

Anyway, I'm contacting the prefecture directly Monday to try and get an answer...

Cheers to you..
voyager en bus camping car, pure aventure ! ! ! ! les rêves sont faits pour être réalisés…
SP Sputnick Regular ·
Hi RémyS53R. yeah, you can drive a bus with 8+1 seats with a C permit, but you should (normally) have gotten the downclassification from DRIRE (mines) to VASP or PL. that said, chances are you won't get hassled if your bus hasn't been switched to PL yet, unless you run into a stickler...
BA Balek ·
I'm in a similar situation. I just bought a Mercedes bus in Tarbes and I need to drive it to Puy-en-Velay (while it's still registered as TCP on my registration papers and I only have an HGV license). So I called about ten police stations and they all told me they'd immobilize the vehicle and suspend my license, at best until the court hearing. (Even though my DRIRE file is almost complete and I've removed all the seats...). So it's risky! Only do it if you don't have any other options... While I'm at it, I want to post a message: I'm looking for someone with some spare time and a TCP permit to bring my bus from Tarbes (65) to Puy-en-Velay (43). It's quite urgent. Contact me at balek@etnoka.fr And thanks to Remy for the info - for Mercedes it's EVOBUS you need to contact and it costs 385. Safe travels everyone and see you in Czechia for early August!
never stop techno music
GX GX47 Regular ·
Hi everyone😉

I'm answering all the questions about licensing, past and future:

The law says:

Over 3.5t truck = D license

Over 3.5t passenger vehicle, 9 seats max = C license (or EC if trailer over 750 kg)

Over 3.5t passenger vehicle + 9 seats, D license (and technically C but there's a gray area here because with 9+ seats it should remain a truck so you should have on your registration: "dual bodywork" or "unspecified")

In any case, driving a truck with a C license = as "balek" said IMMOBILIZATION of the vehicle and major trouble, especially if some jerk on a motorcycle without lights comes and hits your coach! Your insurer will drop you.🙁

There are equivalences depending on the year you got your license (with or without restrictions) but they must appear on your license!

Many have slipped through the cracks, but from what I know, I guarantee you that coaches are on the radar and the gendarmerie is now sharp and impartial😠

Now everyone does what they want. Just think about a possible little accident with a granny who didn't see the stop sign🤪 or your coach 😄

If it's just property damage you'll just have to pay for the damage even if you're not at fault because you shouldn't have been there, because you don't have the right license, because ...etc...etc...

PS: I have a truck and an EC license, I got it insured without a problem because while waiting for the inspection, I have a driver... and because I'm known (that helps) but if I take the coach and I "crash" the insurance warned me: they won't know me anymore !🏴‍☠️😕
GX47

ex transformation, homologation et utilisation d'un car en CC 9places route en utilisation pro. Plus un CC 6pl VL, plus un fourgon en cabine approfondie 6 pl VL. si je peu aider...
DY Dyane25 ·
Thanks for the info! I'd love to see photos of converted buses or ones being converted, just to get an idea of what it could look like. I'm planning to do a similar project myself sometime soon. Thanks!
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DY Dyane25 ·
Hi, I'd also like to know how much it costs to get a heavy truck license in France today. Thanks for your answers! And for some beautiful luxury motorhome inspiration—search Google Images and type 'motorhome'—some of them cost a fortune! Happy building, everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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PA Patrick26 Veteran ·
Completely agree with GX47!

To get your truck license, it costs €1,000 for Class C at CHAZOT in Bourg-les-Valence (26).

It's one of the biggest in France (16,500 students pass in heavy goods!), with accommodation for people coming from far away, 4 or 5 practice ranges for maneuvers, 10 or 12 trucks, and friendly instructors who are laid-back...

Plus, the price is "until you pass," which is rare in HGV.

It kind of looks like an ad, but it's helpful info and it's from a friend!

Have a good evening everyone,

PATRICK26
TH Thmou ·
Hi

I have an S53 bus converted into a motorhome and registered. On the registration document a PTRA appears—has anyone already towed a trailer behind this type of bus? Do you need an adapter piece?

I asked at Renault PL, but they couldn't answer me.

Cheers
DY Dyane25 ·
Thanks for your response (PATRICK26). 1000 euros isn't expensive for a project like this, since I'm planning to live in it year-round. Do you have any idea what the average annual maintenance cost for a bus would be? And what material should the cabin/living partition be made of? I'm waiting to have everything I need (permit and bus) before getting the current regulations—they change so often...

See you soon and safe travels! !
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RémyS53R ·
hello sputnik

thanks for your response but I looked into it thoroughly and it's bad news, the prefecture and the police both gave me the same answer, in case of traffic stops the 'law enforcement' refer to what's on the vehicle registration, meaning TCP, 51 seats (in my van), so given that I only have a Class C license, it could be really problematic...

so I'm working on a little something...

See you..................
voyager en bus camping car, pure aventure ! ! ! ! les rêves sont faits pour être réalisés…
RémyS53R ·
Hey balek,

Well, I can tell you, I'm in the same situation. I went to the prefecture and two police stations and they all gave me the same answer—it's the car registration that counts. And in a vehicle where you get pulled over, that's really risky...

Did you find a garage that does the inspection for €385??? Or are you the one taking it to the inspection office for that price???

Good luck finding a driver...

See you on the forum...

Rémy
voyager en bus camping car, pure aventure ! ! ! ! les rêves sont faits pour être réalisés…
RémyS53R ·
hey gx47,

I just checked your message. I got the info from the prefecture and the local police this week and it's crystal clear—they won't budge. It's pretty much what the officer told me...

and with insurance, it's the same story. I have a buddy driving the bus from the municipal depot to the garage where I'm buying it, and they're handling the RTI (I'm doing the modifications myself), and the insurer told me that if something happened to me on that trip while the bus was still in transit and I was the one driving, they wouldn't cover me......

bottom line—you gotta be by the book to avoid a lot of trouble...-- to thmou:

for the hitch, on the S53, if you have a rear compartment normally just behind the door in the center, on the floor there's a little hatch and underneath you have a spot for a connector (generally cars have a ball hitch and trucks have a connector)... your trailer bar will pass under the compartment and you fit the connector in from inside...--

see you on the forum...................
voyager en bus camping car, pure aventure ! ! ! ! les rêves sont faits pour être réalisés…
RémyS53R ·
Hey dyane25,

just for info, I think I'll manage for around 7000 for the bus + conversion + registration, but I'm only at the start... and it might not all go as planned... anyway, it's already started...

about the license, I confirm 100% what you said Patrick26, Chazot is such a great school, I got my license there and there were people from all over France, it's the best bang for your buck you'll find, I got my license in 3 weeks, no problem, and there's a really good vibe...

if you manage your project, there's no reason you won't make it, fulfill your dreams, don't stop at the border.....of your dreams. I started a year ago, I got my license in May last year and hunted for buses, I did my research well and found one only two months ago (but I have to say I was picky, not too expensive and in very good condition - that doesn't come around often, especially from transit companies), and I'll have it in only a week because it's still running for school transport until July 1st... then this winter it's going to be DIY time... slowly but surely...

Rémy
voyager en bus camping car, pure aventure ! ! ! ! les rêves sont faits pour être réalisés…
SP Sputnick Regular ·
RémyS53R, sure it's at your own risk and peril to drive with a C license for the bus, but without the seats at least! Avoid it, but it works...
DY Dyane25 ·
Hey everyone!!!!!!!!!!!! To get my boss at PSA Sochaux to help finance this 😏, he won't see a big hole in his wallet with the profit involved - it'll just take a bit longer but every bit of profit helps!!!! I'm wondering if at the certification level it wouldn't be simpler with a semi-trailer. Does anyone have info on this or know someone who's already done it? (Actually I only need 3 seats, and in a semi-trailer you could set up a nice little car garage in there)
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SP Sputnick Regular ·
It's possible, but there's no access to the driver's cab...
DY Dyane25 ·
Hi SPUTNICK, no worries about getting through the cabin. I'm mainly looking for a large mobile home to live in year-round and move around as I please, while still having a car, a bike, or something to access different city centers — because even with a bus it's not that simple to get around, plus what really bugs me is this whole driver door issue. Anyway, I've still got time to think it through and pull off a killer project! See you later........

TRAVELS FORM THE YOUTH AND DEFORM THE SUITCASES
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GX GX47 Regular ·
Hey 🙂

Don't write that—there are people who'll be tempted 🤪. The cops don't care whether you have seats or not 🤪. It's actually worse (it's not up to code anymore! 🏴‍☠️). And they don't get in; they just check your registration and license. Plus you need a valid driving license, or you're in trouble 🏴‍☠️.

The gendarmes are under orders, especially during vacation season. As soon as they spot an old truck or anything that looks modified, they pull you over! It brings in revenue 😏. And besides, they're not taking on extra risk 😛. If they let something through and there's an accident further down the road, they risk getting in trouble too, so they crack down 😕
GX47

ex transformation, homologation et utilisation d'un car en CC 9places route en utilisation pro. Plus un CC 6pl VL, plus un fourgon en cabine approfondie 6 pl VL. si je peu aider...
DY Dyane25 ·
You're right, GX47. You've gotta follow the rules from A to Z. If something goes wrong, it's jail time with surely a driving license ban for quite a few years. Speaking of that, here's a little story that'll make some "road pros" bristle.

Last year in HAUTE SAONE (near my place), a school bus driver was caught with 2g and some stuff in her blood behind the wheel of her bus with kids in it.

She was recently tried and got 2 months jail, 6 months suspended, and a 2-year ban on retaking her driving test.

In her defense, she says that day she wasn't supposed to work—it was her boss who called her for a last-minute replacement. She was afraid of losing her job.

So when it comes to safety, alcohol, physical condition (fatigue...), pay attention. The danger doesn't necessarily come from others. It could've happened to any of us.

THERE ARE RULES, EVEN IF SOME SEEM STUPID, BUT YOU CAN'T IGNORE THEM BECAUSE IF YOU GET CAUGHT YOU CAN LOSE A LOT.

SEE YOU SOON AND SAFE DRIVING.
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JC Jcteam ·
Hi, I just bought a Volvo B10M bus. I'm writing because I have the same question—do you have any answers? Thanks
JC Jcteam ·
Hello, I just read a message you posted back in February 2005. It actually provides part of the answer to my question.

In fact, I just bought a Volvo B10M with a driver-side door, and I'd like to downgrade it to 9 seats. The rear section will be converted into a workshop and race car transport. I'll therefore need to open the rear to load my car.

Do you have any information about downgrading to 9 seats (is it just a simple technical inspection)? And what administrative paperwork do I need for this?

Thank you for your response. Talk soon, Jean-Louis
PA Patrick26 Veteran ·
Hi there,

for your Volvo, you'll need to:

1- go through the authorities to reclassify it as a VASP (fewer than 9 seats) 2- install a load barrier made of 40x40 mm tubes with 2 mm thickness. You'll need uprights and cross-members spaced less than 40 cm apart. (They perform the "balloon test", with a 40 cm diameter balloon that shouldn't be able to fit through into the living area.) The covering must be made with sheet metal or 19mm marine plywood.

However, I have a couple of questions:

What year is your Volvo? Because to be able to carry a car, you have to meet two requirements: 1- integral chassis (and depending on the year of manufacture, the B10M either has an integral chassis, a tubular frame with false rear chassis, or an all-tubular frame) 2- have a mid-mounted engine (and depending on the year, it could be rear-mounted)

Next, you'll need authorization from the manufacturer to drill into the body, because the rear of the bus can't be part of the body's structural rigidity. The authorities will ask for it.

Good luck to you - I personally spent 8 months of various negotiations to get all the approvals.

PATRICK26
BA Bastien59 ·
Hi!

Could you send us photos of your B110 4x4? And would you be okay with me putting them in the gallery on my father's website, along with a short text about your project?

Sébastien.
FE Feste ·
Hey there!! I was actually thinking about buying a van to head to Africa. We were just wondering whether it would be better to convert a camper van ourselves or buy one that's already outfitted. Given the price difference in insurance between a registered camper van and an unregistered one, we wanted to get ours homologated. Do you know how to go about getting homologation and what paperwork you need?
DY Dyane25 ·
Hey Patrick26, do you have any layout plans you could post online or email? Also, could you give me your buddy's number—the one who runs the driving school? Thanks!

Safe travels and have a great vacation everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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PA Patrick26 Veteran ·
For the driving school, it's:

Auto-École Chazot 55 av Marc Urtin 26500 Bourg lès Valence .04 75 43 50 86

Email: auto-ecole@ffrchazot.com

Specialized since 1967 in heavy-duty vehicle and bus licenses. C - EC - D
VI Vincent500 ·
Hi,

I'm new to the forum and would like to know what the limitations are (besides budget) for traveling around the world with a converted coach?

What problems might you encounter with: ferries and intercontinental cargo ships, road conditions in Africa and Asia, and entry permits in certain countries with such a large vehicle???

I'm planning to do a 2-3 year trip with my partner in a few years, and I'm exploring all the possibilities.

Thanks in advance for any responses! 😎
DY Dyane25 ·
If anyone is passing through the MONTBELIARD BELFORT area, please let me know! I'd really like to see what a motorhome conversion looks like and get 2 or 3 tips. Have a great trip!
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PI Pictben ·
Hi Patrick,

I've been reading about your project for an hour and I'm getting back the energy I'd lost about converting a bus to travel or just live in while doing missions.

That's cool, I'm continuing to read—I still need quite a bit of information about the mines, places to buy it, insurance...

By the way, if you have a moment...

Otherwise, thanks already for the re-motivation, hope it sticks.

benjamin
Souris à la vie, la vie te sourira.
DY Dyane25 ·
Hi, thanks for all the great info you share with everyone! I have a question to ask: for those of you who are into converting (not me yet), here's the problem:

Mr. Dupont bought a bus (S53 from 1985, for example). This Mr. would like to convert it into a camper van (4 seats + 1 driver in the cab and 0 in the living area), and from the cab you can access the living area.

QUESTION #1: Does Mr. Dupont need to install seat belts in the cab (according to current laws) since he'll need to have the registration document updated?

QUESTION #2: If you can't access the living area (van) from the cab, do you need seat belts in the cab?

Thanks, see you soon!
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SA Saen ·
So from what I know, you don't need to make modifications on that (a buddy converted an S45 into a VASP last year, no installation needed, drive 66, he kept 4 benches, 8 places + a stopcharge as a divider, you can even put a net on it, it works), but maybe standards have evolved, anyway good luck to you!!!, Mr. Dupont can therefore start his conversion without overthinking it because summer's already here ;😉 bye
PA Patrick26 Veteran ·
From what I recall, all heavy vehicles from before 1995 are exempt from seatbelt requirements if they weren't originally equipped with them (see the red striped marking on the vehicle) when updating vehicle registration through RTI.

but given my advanced age and my memory which can play tricks on me, I advise validating this point with the DRIRE.

good evening everyone,

PATRICK26

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