Looking for feedback and advice on a Thailand-Laos-Cambodia itinerary plan
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DJ Djalma Globetrotter ·
Hi, I did it by bus from Pakse with a return to Pakse... with 3 stops including 2 nights at Tad Fan, one at Tad Lo, and another a few kilometers from Tad Lo at Somphone’s village (Ban Lavang). So, in total, 4 nights on the plateau, and I didn’t do the "Grand" tour. However, I did 3 hikes of 5 to 6 hours—2 at Tad Fan, 1 at Tad Lo, and another full-day hike with Somphone... (Hiking to ethnic villages, waterfalls, etc., is kind of my thing.) You can do the grand tour in a single day if you rent a motorbike and just ride all day (many people do it), but in my opinion, the absolute minimum is 2 days. I didn’t rent a motorbike after meeting 2 people who broke down on the route + lots of flat tires!
DJ Djalma Globetrotter ·
P.S.: There’s a pretty detailed map here of the small and large loops on the Bolaven Plateau (no motorbike needed!😉)—what’s described in the guide is super easy to do if you take your time. https://kristof.club/plateau-bolovens-sans-moto/

And here’s a simple diagram: https://www.globe-trotting.com/post/plateau-des-bolovens-au-laos
SO Songsam Veteran ·
Thanks for your two replies, Pled can draw inspiration from them.
DJ Djalma Globetrotter ·
For hiking enthusiasts in the area. The work is already well done! I particularly recommend it because some trails are relatively easy and even marked—rare in Laos! I regret not staying longer… The 4000 Islands further south were a bit disappointing. There’s also the Vat Phou site near Champassak, which is okay, but the bike ride is still nice. There’s also an island opposite Champassak (I’ve forgotten the name). You cross by boat with your bikes, and it’s a gorgeous ride too! Not many people compared to the islands near the Cambodian border (not quite overtourism yet, but close). https://kristof.club/tad-lo-boloven/
PL Pled Regular ·
Hi Kate, I’ve already booked my Paris-Bangkok tickets for early September... (https://www.skyscanner.fr/). Last trip, I’d planned way ahead, worried about prices going up, but in the end, they were the same just a few weeks before departure. I don’t think there’s really a rule—unless there’s a big jump in oil prices...

For domestic flights, like Phnom Penh-BKK, I always book last minute. The price is still pretty low anyway.
PL Pled Regular ·
Yes, thanks @Djalma for all this info and the really interesting links about the Bolaven Plateau.

I’ll take a close look at them. I enjoy hiking, but with age and a minor circulation issue in one leg, I have to take it easy: carrying my backpack all day is no longer an option. Without a bag, and if the elevation gain isn’t too steep, I can still manage... :-) I’ll read through those links carefully...

I really liked the Vat Phou site in Champasak, though—I went there in the morning and found a special atmosphere. I didn’t visit the island across from it, though, so that’ll be a great opportunity for a bike ride!

@Songsam: You’re right, I misjudged the number of days for "Laos 2"—your schedule seems more realistic. I’ll adjust based on the info Djalma shared. And no, I don’t plan to go back to the western part of the country, partly because if the borders are closed, it’d force a U-turn. Plus, I’ve already been to Siem Reap/Angkor twice...
PL Pled Regular ·
Here I am again after some long reflection and looking over the entire route for this trip: Actually, I’m a bit stuck because I have to leave Cambodia by plane from Phnom Penh and end up in BKK, so I’ve revised my itinerary: I’m moving all of Ratchaburi & Uthai Thani to the return in Thailand (after Laos and Cambodia). I’ll leave BKK heading to Isan, and as a result, I’ll have time to go to Khong Chiam, which saves me from paying for the Cambodian visa twice—it was a bit silly. The Savannakhet-Paksé route is a 4-hour bus ride, which should be fine. I’ve also dropped the idea of Attapeu based on Djalma’s advice.

Here’s what it looks like now:

Thailand 1 Ayutthaya (3 nights) - Pakchong (2 nights) - Phimai (3 nights) - Roi Et (3 nights) - Ubon Ratchathani (2 nights) - Khong Chiam (3 nights) - Nakhon Phanom (2 nights)

=> Question: Is it possible to go from Khong Chiam to Nakhon Phanom in one day?

Total TH1: 18 nights - Remaining: 55 nights

Laos I’ve decided not to do the motorbike "loops" (Thakhek & Bolaven), but instead to take transport to specific spots (Konglor and Tad Lo, respectively) and spend a few days there. It’s more relaxed, especially since I’ve already seen Tad Fan, Tad Yuang, Tad Champi, and Tad Itou, the waterfalls closest to Paksé.

Thakhek (2 nights) - Konglor (5 nights) - Thakhek (1 night) - Savannakhet (2 nights) - Paksé (2 nights) - Tad Lo (5 nights) - Paksé (1 night) - Champassak (2 nights) - Don Khon (3 nights)

Total LAOS: 23 nights - Remaining: 32 nights

Departure from Don Khon, cross the border, then Stoeng Treng (80 km) and Kratie (150 km). => Should be doable in a day, to be confirmed.

Cambodia I’ll head south fairly quickly, since I already know this entire area (I’ll pass through again with pleasure, but won’t linger).

Kratie (2 nights) - Kampong Cham (2 nights) - Phnom Penh (1 night) - Kep (4 nights)

Total CAMB: 9 nights Remaining: 23 nights

Return to Phnom Penh by bus (4-hour trip, arriving at noon), then flight to Bangkok. => Should be doable in a day, to be confirmed.

Thailand 2

Bangkok (1 night) - Kanchanaburi (3 nights) - Thong Pha Phum (2 nights) - Sangkhlaburi (4 nights) - Kanchanaburi (1 night) - Uthai Thani (3 nights) - Return to Bangkok (1 night?)

9 nights left: - Spend a week around Ban Phe (across from Ko Samet). I met some French travelers who raved about this quiet, authentic little spot—and it’s not too far from Bangkok. - Return to BKK for the last 2 or 3 days.
SO Songsam Veteran ·
Ayutthaya (3 nights) - Pakchong (2 nights) - Phimai (3 nights) - Roi Et (3 nights) - Ubon Ratchathani (2 nights) - Khong Chiam (3 nights) - Nakhon Phanom (2 nights)

=> Question: Is it possible to go from Khong Chiam to Nakhon Phanom in one day?

From Phimai, you go up... then down... then up again. I think Phimai-Ubon R.-Khong Chiam-Roi Et-Nakhon Phanom would make more sense, reduce the number of kilometers, and your question wouldn’t even come up. The trip from K. Chiam to Roi Et via Ubon could be done in the same day if you leave early.

Cambodia I’m heading pretty quickly to the south, since I already know that whole area (I’ll pass through again with pleasure, but won’t linger)

Kratie (2 nights) - Kampong Cham (2 nights) - Phnom Penh (1 night) - Kep (4 nights)

Total CAMB: 9 nights

So, in short, you’re going to Cambodia just for Kep? Hmm...

Uthai Thani (3 nights) - Return to Bangkok (1 night?) (...) - Spend a week around Ban Phe

Minivans on routes 10 and 903 will take you from Uthai Thani to Mo Chit Minivan Terminal B, and from Terminal C, the 915 to (Ban) Laem Mae Phim* makes a stop in Ban Phe. I don’t know the frequency of these minivans. Plan for 7-8 hours of travel total, plus transfer time. Avoiding an overnight in Bangkok seems doable.

* Small seaside resort (which I don’t know) about twenty kilometers east of Ban Phe.
PL Pled Regular ·
Thanks for your reply, Songsam.

Okay for the Phimai-Ubon R.-Khong Chiam-Roi Et-Nakhon Phanom route—if it’s more logical and shorter, that’s perfect!

About Cambodia, I know it seems short, but that’s because I’ve been there before (I did the Northeast loop two years ago, and Angkor twice already), and the closed land border complicates the original idea of doing a loop. I would’ve liked to go through the north of the country toward the west and Thailand (or along the Tonle Sap), but that’s off the table now... Still, I can extend it a bit depending on how I feel, like stopping in Stung Treng. I’ll see if I’m ahead of schedule or not, especially since the last 9 days can be shortened by a few days too. And I really like the Cambodian vibe, even if it’s only for about ten days! ;-) Kep is because last time, Kampot kind of annoyed me, and during a day in Kep, I chatted with a really nice French guy who goes there every winter and raved about how peaceful Kep is compared to Kampot’s liveliness. That’s why I thought I’d spend a few quiet days there.

Thanks for the info on doing the Uthai Thani-Ban Phe route in one day—it’ll be better than stopping in BKK. Actually, the French people I met in Ko Chang spend part of the winter between Ban Phe and Laem Mae Phim. They’re around Hua Lhaem Beach... The whole area seems nice, so it should be a great way to end the trip!

I’ll think about all this some more, but overall, it’s shaping up well, and I wouldn’t have gotten this far without all your advice. Thanks a million! :)
PL Pled Regular ·
Just a post to share the itinerary in map form (I did this by hand, so the route lines are approximate).

In the end, I moved Kanchanaburi to the beginning—it doesn’t really change anything. Here’s what it looks like, roughly: - one month in Thailand (31 days) - 3 weeks in Laos (23 days) - 2 short weeks in Cambodia (12 days) - 5 days around Ban Phe - 2 days in Bangkok

PS: You can see that the detour to Khong Chiam... is a real detour! 😎
SO Songsam Veteran ·
Stage 3 won’t be Uthai Thani but the transit night in Kanchanaburi on the way back from Sangkhlaburi, but that doesn’t change anything.

Kep-Phnom Penh-flight to Bangkok-Ban Phe in the same day seems ambitious; everything really needs to go smoothly.

The Phnom Penh-Bangkok flight can’t be with AirAsia because their flights are at 9:10 AM (too early after arriving from Kep) and 5:15 PM (arrival at Don Muang at 6:35 PM, a bit late to continue to Ban Phe). The solution will be to fly to Suvarnabhumi with a few possible midday options. From Suvarnabhumi, the nearest bus terminal for a bus to Ban Phe is Ekamai.

In Phnom Penh, a new airport has now been built and replaces the old one for international flights. https://voyageforum.com/forum/nouvel-aeroport-phnom-penh-d10758648/

PS: We can see that the detour to Khong Chiam... is a real detour! 😎

At first, we’d talked about it as part of entering Laos via Pakse, but now it’s a different story, and it really does make a big detour...
PL Pled Regular ·
Thanks Songsam,

Yes, you're right, doing Kep-Phnom Penh-flight to Bangkok-Ban Phe in the same day will indeed be tricky! But it's actually possible from the new airport (KTI), thanks for the info—I’ll note that down, along with Ekamai bus terminal being the closest to Suvarnabhumi. Leaving early from Kep (I saw the first bus at 6:45 AM on this site: https://cambodiatrains.info/bus-times-tickets-kep-to-phnom-penh/), I’d arrive around 11 AM in PP, and there’s a flight at 2:00 PM from KTI to Suvarnabhumi. So it’s doable on paper. And if worst comes to worst, I’ll just spend a night in BKK—I really don’t like traveling under stress with such a tight and risky schedule...

For Khong Chiam, I’ll see how things go on the spot. It’s quite possible I’ll skip this stop (and thus Ubon Ratchathani right after), because honestly, it looks like a hassle! That would give me a few extra days to explore Cambodia more leisurely, maybe stopping in Stung Treng, for example.
ER Erwanploz Regular ·
The ideal route from Kep would be to join National Road 2, which passes through Takeo and then in front of the new airport before arriving in PP. On National Road 3 (Kampot and Kep to Phnom Penh more directly), you pass by the old Pochentong airport—it was convenient... back then! After that, it takes a good hour by road to get from PP’s Central Market to the new KTI airport. If you ever need to leave earlier, before dawn, it’s definitely possible with a local minibus driver (not affiliated with any company). Your accommodation should be able to arrange that for you. There are minibuses leaving at night all over the place (at 3 AM in my village) to reach Phnom Penh by early morning.
SO Songsam Veteran ·
Leaving early from Kep (I saw the first bus at 6:45 AM on this site:

Since Kep is a tourist spot, you might find agency offers for direct shuttles to the airport—a pretty common practice in Southeast Asia.

a timing that’s too tight and risky...

You’re right. It’s a planning mistake that new travelers in Southeast Asia sometimes make—like rushing—and one I always warn them about.

I see a flight around 2:00 PM from KTI to Suvarnabhumi.

Cambodia Airways flight KR703? It doesn’t operate on Tuesdays and Saturdays. But you won’t mind shifting by a day.
SO Songsam Veteran ·
I see a flight at 2:00 PM

I’m coming back to this. You land at Suvarnabhumi at 3:20 PM, +30 min minimum to get through Immigration, clear security, pick up your bag, and find a taxi, +1.5 to 2 hours to get to Ekamai* during rush hour, +3 to 3.5 hours to Ban Phe... I’ll let you work out the approximate arrival time at your destination. * Located on Sukhumvit, one of the most congested arteries in the capital.

at worst, it’ll be a night in BKK
PL Pled Regular ·
Thanks Erwanploz, Yeah, I’ll try to find direct transport to the new KTI airport. It’s south of the city, and it’d save a ton of time! Might even make it possible to reach Ban Phe in the same day... I can get up early, no problem—when I’m traveling, I’m always a bit in "jet lag" mode anyway, so it’s easy! ;-)
PL Pled Regular ·
Seen from this angle, it’ll be a night in Bangkok then! ;-) But as I discussed with Erwanploz, if I can find direct transport to KTI airport early in the morning, it might be doable—allowing me to catch an earlier flight in the morning. Then, from Suvarnabhumi, I can take the train to Ramkhamhaeng station and then a moto-taxi to Ekamai to save time... Well, we’ll see when I get there. By cutting out Khong Chiam, I’ve got a few extra days of flexibility—that’s cool.

So, I updated the map by removing Ubon Ratchathani and Khong Chiam. I also added Thong Pha Phum and Phnom Penh, which were missing, and Stung Treng, since I’ll have time to make a stop there. It’s better this way...
SO Songsam Veteran ·
From Suvarnabhumi, I can take the train to Ramkhamhaeng station, then a moto-taxi to Ekamai to save time...

Great idea.
SO Songsam Veteran ·
From Suvarnabhumi, I can take the train to Ramkhamhaeng station, then a moto-taxi to Ekamai to save time...

Great idea.

I think some trains aren’t local stops only.
SO Songsam Veteran ·
Hi, How did you finally make the Kanchanaburi-Uthai Thani trip? Thanks.

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