Traveling to Cuba and its impact on ESTA applications
FR

Translated into English.

Original post
MA
Hi everyone. For those traveling to Cuba and then planning to go to the USA, you won’t be able to get your ESTA for the United States (same applies) if you’ve been to Cuba after 2021 due to a law passed by Donald Trump (a law that Biden later repealed). You’ll have no choice but to apply for a visa, which costs 200 € (and approval isn’t guaranteed even after payment). If you’re in this situation, the process to get this visa will be a real hassle—you’ll need to book an appointment at the U.S. Embassy in Paris. It’s the only embassy in France authorized to handle your application after you’ve filled out the visa request on the official website. If you try to cheat by applying for an ESTA for the USA, just know that the American administration has ways of finding out if you’ve been to Cuba. 😉
TA Tatra Globetrotter ·
Hi there,

Yes, it’s a classic move, and it didn’t start with Trump. It’s an indirect way of waging war on states they want to weaken—mostly symbolic, though. With the world fragmenting again, you’ll soon see some countries putting up barriers for travelers who’ve visited the U.S., putting them in an impossible situation that’ll make them think twice about traveling. Not for any good reason, just because they’ll need a cheap political gesture that affects almost no one but "speaks" to public opinion. Because let’s be clear: going to Paris to get a visa—taking two days off if you can, with two round trips—is prohibitive for non-Parisians. You’re quickly looking at 1000 €.

l'administration Américaine a les moyens de savoir si vous êtes allé a Cuba

They mostly have the means to *make you believe* they have the means. Around two million undocumented migrants have entered the U.S. in the last five years—if their systems were that effective, you’d have noticed.

Michel
PR Protege Globetrotter ·
Hi

You can request a new passport at your town hall; it’s the easiest way.
PA PapJ59 Globetrotter ·
This is NOT news!

Pretty much since the ESTA existed, it’s been written in BIG LETTERS on the first page of the form.

On most USA-specialized sites, you start by checking the entry requirements...

And FYI, there are other countries on the Red List, not just Cuba.

The access restrictions aren’t unique to Trump or the USA—many other countries have them too...

See you around!
TA Tatra Globetrotter ·
Hello,

Access restrictions aren’t unique to Trump or the USA but apply to many other countries...

I just mentioned above that we might unfortunately see this kind of thing popping up more with the world fragmenting and this new kind of "iron curtain" emerging, but that doesn’t mean it’s normal for a state to restrict access to its territory based on previous visits to other countries. It’s still a peculiarity of the United States. In other cases that exist or have existed, it was just a matter of stamps in the passport, and since those are rare these days .

But once again, at the risk of repeating myself, the point of these measures is to serve as a political communication tool—a political gesture made to a population that actually costs nothing and has no real practical or operational effectiveness.

Michel
CH Cheechako Veteran ·
Hi,

Two round trips from the far-flung province to Paname to apply for and then pick up a visa—luckily, it doesn’t cost or even come close to 1000 euros! And even in first class... For example, from my beloved Brittany, a round trip is around 100 to 120 € (just checked for August...). It’s something I’ve had to do several times for the DRC (and I could’ve just made one trip and had my passport/visa mailed back to me).

It’s still a quirk of the United States.

Oh no—our very charming neighbor, the United Kingdom, and its ETA... simply put.

In other cases that exist or have existed, it was just a matter of stamps in the passport, and since there aren’t many left

Was it? Not sure that’s over. Because those "blacklisted" countries are also the ones that stamp passports... Plus, I know at least two people who aren’t diplomats or secret agents... who legally have two (French) passports for these reasons. So when you say the U.S. mostly has the means to *make* people believe they have the means... I kinda agree. But without absolute certainty, though...

As for undocumented immigrants, that’s another topic—I doubt most of them entered using a European tourist ESTA.
TA Tatra Globetrotter ·
Good evening,

Sounds like a controversial mood. I don’t have much time, nor much desire to get into it. So, a round-trip from Brest or Quimper to Paris, with fixed dates and times—obviously—plus the cost of getting to and from the station, two lost days that are hard or impossible to plan, making it very difficult, if not impossible, to negotiate with an employer. Add the visa fee, and for me, we’re talking around 1000 €. So, if you’re better than me at handling this, I congratulate you. 🙂

Nope: our very charming neighbor, the UK, and its ETA... quite simply.

Is the ETA conditional on not having visited certain countries? I don’t know—do we have the list?

Michel

PS: If you live in Rennes, have no problem taking time off, and can afford to cover the lost income, of course we don’t see things the same way.
AT Attila Globetrotter ·
and for info, there are other countries on the Red List, not just Cuba.

True, but slightly less touristy...😏

Iran, Iraq, Syria, Libya, Somalia, Yemen, or Sudan (travel after 01/03/2011)
CH Cheechako Veteran ·
Sounds like a controversial mood.

😉 Yeah, of course. You know I love this, but only with you, obviously.

Okay, more seriously,

with set times and days

Not entirely: usually, you’re offered a schedule of appointment slots. I thought we were just talking about the direct cost of getting to Paris. But:

the two lost days, impossible or difficult to plan, so very hard, even impossible to negotiate with an employer,

Ah, right, sorry. Being retired myself, I stupidly thought like a retiree! Mea culpa.

So, if you’re still working. Well, it’s going to be more complicated because there are so many different situations! It’s not just employees who travel—far from it! You could be self-employed, for example, a business owner or an organized executive, and "make the most" of these trips, or even more if you’re "clever" (overhead costs), etc. And then, some employees work in professions where these "availability" days are easier to find than others... But in the toughest cases, which might not be yours... it can indeed be a real problem.

For what I’ll call the "additional" costs: Living 60 km from Rennes, for example: the slow train to Rennes costs around 12 €, otherwise the bus (meh...) or a taxi (ouch! around 120 €). Or maybe a sympathetic friend, a helpful colleague, a regular carpool... Finally, when an in-person appointment is mandatory, it’s for the visa application. Once it’s approved, most of the time you can have your passport sent to you. So the cost is then cut in half...

Is the ETA conditional on not having visited certain countries? I don’t know; do we have the list?

Roughly the same as for the ESTA (before the latest Trump-era restrictions): Afghanistan, Eritrea, Yemen... My passport has a beautiful stamp from one of them. Will I have to get a new one?
TA Tatra Globetrotter ·
Hi Kougarok,

I tried to explain it to you: you're retired, you live in Rennes with at least ten shuttles to Montparnasse every day... In that case, of course, it's doable. If the traveler works for an SME, for example, how do you think they’ll manage to request last-minute vacation days like that? If the traveler is a civil servant—even locally—or a teacher, how do you think they can arrange a one-day absence on such short notice? After that, it’s easy and cheap for the U.S. to make travel impossible for people who, deep down, won’t complain loudly and don’t carry any economic weight. It’s not a very glorious policy, and the intended effectiveness is domestic, a bit populist. A certain mindset, let’s say.

By the way, how are the ZFEs in Rennes doing these days?

Michel
AT Attila Globetrotter ·
It’s not one more or one less day of leave that makes a difference for someone wanting to travel to the US.

This visa requirement isn’t exactly a surprise for a traveler who plans ahead.

As for taking time off, unexpected things happen: a medical appointment, a car breakdown, an administrative or bank meeting, a visa application...

Besides, Brittany isn’t any farther from Paris than other regions. From Clermont-Ferrand, you’re never sure you’ll arrive on time given the SNCF’s repeated delays—let alone cancellations...
TA Tatra Globetrotter ·
Hi Agnès,

No, I don’t know what world you’re living in, but no. For a public-school teacher, especially in early grades, for a retail or SME employee, or for a factory worker, it’s simply impossible. I think you’re seriously underestimating the pressures, the blackmail, the rigidities. Maybe you’re lucky enough to be able to do it easily—personally, I might be able to negotiate it, but most people can’t. Not at all.

Brittany isn’t just far in kilometers; it’s also held by the throat by the SNCF monopoly right now. There’s practically no Plan B except taking your car.

Michel
MA Manondugard Regular ·
Hello

Where to apply for a new passport at your town hall; it’s the easiest way.

Hi, I’ve done that, but I wouldn’t risk getting turned away and losing the ticket and the bookings.
VO Voyajou Globetrotter ·
For a public-school teacher, especially in early education, for a retail or SME employee, for a factory worker,

The typical profile of a worker who first traveled to Cuba before considering the U.S. in under ten years—now that’s your sociologist side talking. What kind of polygon are you? Let’s take, at random, another example: a vocational high school teacher nearing retirement in a private school in Lower Brittany. Four months without the obligation to show up for work leaves plenty of time to sort out this kind of contingency.

(As for the rest of your comments, same old obsessive rants disguised as geopolitical reasoning)

@Manon: sorry for hijacking the thread! 🙂
AT Attila Globetrotter ·
.held by the throat by the SNCF monopoly

At least the trains run properly there...

Go to Clermont-Ferrand...

No, I don’t know what world you live in, but no.

You know, slavery ended a long time ago.

And the boss risks ending up without employees if they don’t step up—new generations won’t hesitate to walk out if things aren’t working.

Plus, as Jean Luc mentioned, people who travel to the US and Cuba usually aren’t in the categories mentioned.

After all, a teacher doesn’t spend their whole life at school. A meet-up on a day off or during the previous school holidays, and you’re all set.

Like with a lot of things, it’s all about preparation.
MA Manondugard Regular ·
@Voyajou

No worries, it gives me something to do since I’ve been stuck in the broom closet over on the other forum
TA Tatra Globetrotter ·
Hi Jean Luc,

At least having this kind of perspective doesn’t lead me to lash out with bitter personal attacks. You hate it when people give meaning and analyze things beyond common or initial opinions; it turns out that’s my thing, and for reasons I don’t understand, you can’t stand it.

@Attila You know, when I respond, I might seem like I’m theorizing, but I’m actually thinking of specific people. And I stand by what I said—for those who dream of going to the United States, having to apply for a visa in Paris because they don’t qualify for an ESTA would be a hurdle that would definitely make them give up.

Michel
AT Attila Globetrotter ·
who dream of going to the United States but would have to apply for a visa in Paris instead of an ESTA—it’d definitely make them think twice and probably give up.

Dreaming of the U.S. while having previously traveled to Cuba, with little money, barely any vacation time, bosses straight out of *Les Misérables*, and zero organizational skills—it’s such a bummer...
MA Manondugard Regular ·
Hi everyone, and sorry if I’m not totally familiar with the forum (apparently there’s no button to reply to someone specifically, only within the thread).

Personally, I haven’t worked in ages and live in the south of France. I posted this topic partly to chat with everyone, but mostly to get feedback from those who’ve gone "all in" to the USA after 2021 (with the new rules) by bending the truth on their ESTA—and who weren’t turned away.

I really want to visit this continent, but it’d be a real obstacle course if I followed the visa process: paying 200 € (non-refundable if I don’t get the visa, which, from what I’ve heard, is handed out pretty arbitrarily or based on the officer’s mood). After filling out the form on the official site, I’d need to schedule a meet-up in Paris (round-trip flight + parking + 2-hour airport transfers each way since I live in the mountains). I’d get an appointment between 2 and 6 months later—yes, there’s a long wait—plus I don’t have a clean criminal record (you might say they don’t have the means to check it or my trip to Cuba, but I doubt it). And all that for a hypothetical visa approval. The only upside is I could visit the capital while I’m there, but on the Routard forum, people who go to NY regularly say the agents at the airport are sharp psychologists who can spot lies, and even after 15 trips there, the questions they ask feel like a full-on interrogation.

So if anyone’s fudged the details and gotten away with it, let’s talk about it here—it’d be super helpful for me and others. 🙂
BI Biggie Regular ·
Hi Manondugard,

Unfortunately, you're in a tricky situation, but trying to commit fraud is absolutely not a good idea—it would only make things worse and could jeopardize any future trips to the U.S. for years.

Hello,

Where do you apply for a new passport at your town hall; it’s the simplest option.

Hi, I’ve done that, but I wouldn’t risk being turned away and losing the ticket and reservations.

It’s important to know that trying to bypass the restriction by getting a new passport won’t change anything. There’s an information-sharing system between the U.S. and the EU for all passengers. They know all about your previous trips.

Looking for feedback from anyone who went to the U.S. "by force" after 2021 (and its new regulations) by lying on the ESTA and wasn’t turned away.

I really doubt it’s possible to lie on the ESTA, especially about previous destinations, since they have the means to verify. If you make a false declaration, you risk a visa ban for several years.

It would be a real obstacle course if I followed the visa procedure (paying 200 €—non-refundable if I don’t get the visa, which, from what I’ve heard, is handed out haphazardly or based on the officer’s mood).

Yes, getting a B2 visa is an obstacle course, but it’s not handed out haphazardly or based on the officer’s mood. You need to provide all the requested documents, prove to the officer that you have sufficient ties to France (property, job, etc.) so you’re not tempted to immigrate illegally, that you have sufficient funds, etc. Having been to Cuba *and* having a criminal record definitely won’t work in your favor.

The agents at the airport are sharp psychologists and know how to detect lies, and even after 15 trips there, the questions asked feel like a real interrogation.

Well, yes, they’re sharp psychologists, but it’s still far from a real interrogation! With my history, I usually just get a "welcome back" 😉

I understand your frustration, but trying to bypass the law by any means isn’t an honorable approach. Wait a few years—who knows, maybe this law will simply be repealed someday.

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