No, I Won’t Be Going Back to China
FR

Translated into English.

Original post
ER
Hello forum,

Did any of you feel the same things we did in China?

We spent a good twenty days there in August. First, we traveled solo around Chengdu, then joined an organized tour for 12 days (Beijing, Pingyao, Xi'an, Guilin, Xingping, Yangshuo, Shanghai, Wuzhen) and extended our stay by 4 extra days to visit Zhangjiajie.

The landscapes were stunning, and we have unforgettable memories... but we were really disappointed by the following points:

- The food: way too spicy. Lacking in flavor, not much taste. I’m speaking "in general" because we did enjoy some good steamed dumplings, smoked pork, and other dumplings... But compared to Thailand, Cambodia, or India, Chinese cuisine didn’t impress us at all.

- The behavior of the Chinese: disrespectful, rushed, agitated. You constantly have to fight—people push, crowd, and overwhelm you... At the entrance to the Terracotta Army (and other sites), it’s a human tidal wave... and I mean that literally. We were carried by the crowd without even touching the ground. It was like a situation where you have one bowl of rice and 20,000 starving people diving for it...

You’re at a ticket counter, and they cut in front of you. You’re in line for boarding, suitcase ready to go on the conveyor belt, and someone shows up out of nowhere to put THEIR suitcase down... even though they have a flight ticket with THEIR seat number and won’t be leaving before you!!!! You’re getting on the bus, and someone shoves past you just so they don’t end up behind you.

It’s like these people only think about themselves. I didn’t see a single person let someone else go first or even ask—it’s as if politeness and respect are completely foreign to them.

It’s honestly exhausting and draining...

- Communication: In every other country we’ve visited, whether in Asia or Europe, we always manage—with English, a few words of Italian, French, or Spanish. In China, I’ll be blunt: if you don’t speak Chinese, you’re screwed. And yet, a pair of kids around ten or twelve years old asked us in English where we were from :)

- Understanding: Here’s the rule. Even if the person you’re talking to speaks a little English and says they understand you... make sure they *really* do, because 9 times out of 10, they don’t. Out of pride or just cluelessness, they’ll give you a big smile and nod, but in reality, they didn’t get what you were saying.

Several times with our group, in the evening at a restaurant, if we hadn’t been helped by someone at another table who spoke a little English, we’d still be there. The classic example: the waiter brings one menu (for 10 people at the table), and we’re all trying to explain that we need 4 or more menus. Five minutes later, he’s still staring at us with that same blank smile...

In 3* or 4* hotels, you go to the front desk for a hot water or AC issue. Three or four staff members just stand there beaming at you. You try to explain with photos or a translator, but in the end, you leave with the problem unresolved.

They don’t speak—they shout... on buses, in hotels...

We were also surprised to find that self-service laundromats were almost nonexistent. We got scammed once at a hotel with an astronomical bill!

As for flights, we flew Air China on the way there and Austrian Airlines on the way back—no comparison. Air China had zero service and food that was "baby food" quality. Austrian Airlines had multiple services, a decent meal, and smiling flight attendants.

I don’t know if any of you had the same experience in this country, but I’m definitely not eager to go back. Whereas if someone offered me India, Thailand, or Vietnam tomorrow, I’d be there in a heartbeat!!!
DE Denis007 Regular ·
Hello

Well, if I get the chance, I’d go back one day!

Sure, the Chinese can sometimes be more than rude (even shocking from our point of view) in public places like you described, sure they shout to talk to each other (even when they’re right next to each other in the same car!), sure the crowds in tourist spots are on a whole other level compared to Europe and can feel overwhelming, sure communication can be tough since few people know even a few words of English, and yet...

And yet, it’s that unique atmosphere—and especially the (relative) difficulty of communication—that gives it all its charm and appeal. I’ve traveled to many countries, and China is the one (along with India, in a different way) that gave me the strongest sense of being somewhere completely different, the feeling of truly being "abroad," the happiness of managing to make myself understood and get what I wanted with just 3 or 4 words of Chinese, that constant sense of satisfaction for even the smallest things that kept my trip moving forward...

After all, everyone has their own experience, their own feelings, their own sensitivity.

You compare it to India and Southeast Asia, but it seems to me that Indians are just as rude in queues (when queues even exist and don’t look like a giant rugby scrum!), that food is much spicier in India and can be just as spicy in Thailand, and that if you ask a question in those countries and the person doesn’t know the answer, you’ll get a big smile and a made-up response just because they don’t want to say no or admit they don’t know. A lot of these things aren’t unique to China.
JI JianadaRen Globetrotter ·
When you travel, you experience things that are different from home. That’s the whole point. Plus, you were on a package tour, so the food was definitely bottom-of-the-barrel quality. There are more Chinese people who speak English than there are English people in England. But those who are better educated aren’t working as servers in restaurants. I wonder how many servers in France speak Mandarin. Actually, American tourists often complain that servers in France don’t speak English... Next time, if you want fewer crowds, don’t go during summer vacation.
MA Marathon Globetrotter ·
- the food: way too spicy. No flavors, little taste. I’m speaking "in general" because we did try some good steamed dumplings, smoked pork, and dumplings...

Hi there,

Talking about Chinese food "in general" makes as little sense as talking about European food "in general," since China has the same size and diversity as Europe. Starting your trip around Chengdu, it was inevitable you’d encounter very spicy food, as Sichuan province is famous for that—just like Hunan, where Zhangjiajie is located.

I found this paragraph amusing because I’d just eaten Chongqing noodles with a Chinese friend who was literally on fire, but I wasn’t. The difference between us? She’s from Beijing, while I "trained" in Chengdu. Some Chinese people struggle just as much as you do with certain Chinese dishes!
RA Ragamuffin Globetrotter ·
Good evening

It's best not to visit a country when you're in a bad mood; you end up blaming the country for your mood and drawing false conclusions. Paul Theroux - The Great Railway Bazaar

"They don’t know how to talk, they shout... on the bus, at the hotel..."

The Chinese speak very loudly, in a deafening, harassing, and non-stop manner, as if no one ever listens to them and they have to shout to be heard. The radio and television are always at full volume. Why? Are they all afflicted with congenital deafness, or is it just a rather detestable habit? They leave doors open—it’s a national habit. Paul Theroux - Riding the Iron Rooster

I loooooove China

photos.google.com/...aUJOcVBPV0lqcnF4Ql9R
ZO Zola101 Veteran ·
Well... 😮

For me, all your “negative” experiences (behavior, communication, understanding) are exactly why I L-O-V-E-D China and would happily go back!

I never felt oppressed or pressured... I found the Chinese people so willing to help, and I got a lot of help during some pretty stressful moments!!! Plus, they didn’t hesitate to share their food with me—on the train, in lines, you name it.

Their curiosity and the way they openly stare always made me smile! And I think they have a great sense of humor!

As for communication and the struggle to be understood, I think that’s all part of the adventure! 😛

I traveled solo without a set itinerary, and I’d do it all over again—just more in the southwest of China to explore even more of the countless landscapes in this beautiful country!

🙂
ZO Zola101 Veteran ·
If you haven't already, go to Japan—you'll be much happier than in China 😉
ER Ericdu38 Regular ·
Good evening

It's best not to visit a country when you're in a bad mood; you end up blaming the country for your mood and drawing false conclusions. Paul Théroux - Railway Bazaar

Oh really, you think I went there in a bad mood? What a preconception!!!

I loooooove China

Good thing not everyone thinks like me!!!
ER Ericdu38 Regular ·
Hello,

Well, if I get the chance, I’ll definitely go back one day!

Sure, the Chinese can sometimes be more than just rude (even downright shocking from our perspective) in public places like you described, sure they shout to talk to each other (even when they’re right next to each other in the same train car!), sure the crowds at tourist sites are on a whole other level compared to Europe and can feel overwhelming, sure communication is sometimes tough because few people know even a few words of English, and yet...

And yet, it’s that unique atmosphere—and especially the (relative) difficulty of communication—that gives it all its charm and appeal. I’ve traveled to many countries, and China is the one (along with India, in a different way) that gave me the strongest sense of being somewhere completely foreign, that feeling of really being "abroad," the satisfaction of managing to make myself understood and get what I wanted with just 3 or 4 words of Chinese, that constant sense of accomplishment for even the smallest things that kept my trip moving forward...

After all, everyone has their own experience, their own feelings, their own sensitivity.

You compare it to India and Southeast Asia, but from what I remember, Indians can be just as rude in lines (when lines even exist and don’t look like a giant rugby scrum!), the food in India is way spicier and can be just as spicy in Thailand, and if you ask a question in those countries and the person doesn’t know the answer, you’ll often get a big smile and a made-up response just because they don’t want to say no or admit they don’t know—so a lot of these things aren’t unique to China.

I’ve still been to the Asian countries I mentioned (Thailand twice, India three times...) during French school holidays, and I never felt those kinds of crowds, whether in temples, at the Taj Mahal, or anywhere else.

Clearly, it’s a very personal experience and feeling I had, and I can totally understand why everyone who responded loves China for all sorts of great reasons!)
RA Ragamuffin Globetrotter ·
Hi there!

Oh right! You forgot about the Chinese who smoke everywhere, even where it’s forbidden 😕



(Oh but) it’s only China and I like it
ER Ericdu38 Regular ·
Hello

Oh yeah! You forgot about the Chinese who smoke everywhere, even where it's forbidden 😕

Thanks for your very relevant comments, this will help move the debate and perspectives forward 😉
SI Sitik Veteran ·
Traveling solo must’ve been really tough with that mindset. China is China—full of Chinese people, lots of Chinese people. It might be my gray hair. Let them shout, let them jostle—it’s just Chinese people, and honestly, I think you’re exaggerating. I stayed right in the center of Chengdu, in the pedestrian streets inside a big shopping mall. There were a lot of young people, but they weren’t disrespectful at all. I’ve always found Chinese people ready to help me. I travel solo, but for six weeks, and I never had anything to complain about. It’s true—I’ve always traveled solo.
PA Parigino Veteran ·
Oh, when they talk loud, they *really* talk loud! Crank up your music—it’ll make everyone laugh 😎

Yeah, they don’t always respect queues. If someone cuts in front of you, grab their arm and point them to the back of the line. Better to yell on the spot than at home 😎

When you’re traveling solo in more isolated areas, you’ll even get stared at by passersby—or pointed at by kids. Just do the same; it lightens the mood 😎

I’ve never exchanged so many smiles with people (of all ages) as I have in China. Just today, the train ticket vendor—who I thought was super stiff when it was my turn—ended up grinning ear to ear when she handed me my ticket. I think we were both just happy we’d managed to get past the hurdle! Someone mentioned Japan, a truly beautiful country, but interactions there are pretty much nonexistent.

Anyway, China’s cool—*really* cool. And the people are super nice. There’s just one thing I can’t get used to: cigarettes *everywhere*, often where they’re not allowed. Other than that, I highly recommend it. Just be aware there are 1.2 billion people, so yeah, the roads are crowded!
MA Mathews Globetrotter ·
China is China, with Chinese people, loads of Chinese people.

Not related at all, but it reminds me of a certain Guy Bedos sketch, lol 🙂
SI Sitik Veteran ·
Yes, even the cops are Chinese—and worse, so are the military personnel.
KE Kera Regular ·
I loooooove China

photos.google.com/...aUJOcVBPV0lqcnF4Ql9R

I love China and your photos that capture it so well... I’ve been twice and can’t wait to go back. Best regards,
ER Ericdu38 Regular ·
Well, I’ll be heading to Kerala, Cambodia, or Malaysia instead 😉
KE Kera Regular ·
Good evening Eric, I don’t dispute your feelings about China; you have to consider the affinities you feel for a country. For me, it offers variety, power, and a lack of pretension that suited me. I loved my trip to Cambodia—I’d happily go back—but I wouldn’t expect the same surprises there that China gives me. As for India, so far I’ve only seen Rajasthan, where beauty is so intense everywhere that it can feel overwhelming, even in pilgrimages and crowded gatherings as picturesque as the Pushkar Fair. I’ve met many fans of that underrated Kerala, which I might visit someday. Every country I’ve spent time in has brought me a lot of happiness. It’s a shame to only see the bad sides. Best regards.
ER Ericdu38 Regular ·
There’s no issue at all—just the hasty interpretations some here enjoy making, reading between the lines and judging a bit harshly or ironically what I describe.

Yes, I went to China in August because it wasn’t possible to do otherwise. And if I’d gone to western China, or if I’d traveled there at another time… what if, what if… well, maybe I wouldn’t have had the same things to say.

Yes, some of my comments might seem exaggerated, but after around 20 days there, I was honestly just happy to leave.

If I hadn’t visited some Asian countries before—twice in Thailand, three times in India—I wouldn’t have been able to make comparisons. And if I’d had preconceived notions, I wouldn’t have gone in the first place.

That said, of course we discovered beautiful things and had some great encounters too.

@Kera: I can confirm that Kerala is simply magical—a place I’d recommend visiting first in India! :)
RA Ranskalainen Regular ·
No, I didn’t feel the same way.

I’ve been to China three times for tourism and go there regularly for work.

For me, food is definitely the country’s biggest plus.

It’s not particularly spicy. I was in Malaysia in July—now *that’s* where I cried at every Indian restaurant.

During my first trip to China, I stayed for a month. I learned to say "not spicy," "the bill," and "napkins." And I always got all three.

Now I go regularly to the west coast, and I’ve never had a spicy dish.

The Chinese have a behavior and culture that’s truly whole, not influenced by the outside world, and that’s what makes the country so exotic and fascinating in my opinion. Unlike the other countries you mentioned, they weren’t colonized by Europeans, and you can really feel that! It’s unique, and it was a cultural shock for me too the first time.

As for English... well, I don’t think the English from England or the French are much better at foreign languages. For work, I speak English and manage just fine, like most of my colleagues in trade. We wouldn’t have all our clothes, our laptops, our household appliances... if the Chinese didn’t speak English! Pick a random French or English person in a provincial town, and I’m not sure they’d be very multilingual either.

I’ve seen rest areas in Normandy yell at Dutch people in French without bothering to speak English to them.

For hotels, now that I travel for work, I stay in good, comfortable hotels from international chains—total luxury, no AC issues! And the prices are great compared to Europe... obviously, in a 10 € hotel, I didn’t have the same comfort.

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